The jungle folks are against the defamation lawsuit. Many of them are in favor of having the lawsuit dropped and having the Archbishop step aside to allow Deacon Claros to do his job as the new Sexual Abuse Response Coordinator (SARC). Some even want the Archbishop to follow the fine example of Cardinal Joseph Bernardin (the Cardinal Archbishop of Chicago) when he reached out to his accuser. Here are my reasons why I believe the Archbishop of Guam chose the correct path in pursuing the defamation lawsuit.
First of all, one cannot compare the situation with Cardinal Joseph Bernardin with the predicament facing Archbishop Apuron. In the first place, Cardinal Joseph Bernardin was never harassed, mocked, and persecuted for over a year by a minuscule mob of jungle militants. Also, the person who accused him was NOT a third party, but the victim. Furthermore, the accuser did not make any concessions or bribes such as reinstating anyone, but requested for justice.
It is very clear that the intent of the jungle folks have nothing to do with justice. Their intent is to remove the Archbishop of Guam at whatever cost. Their wider agenda is to destroy the Neocatechumenal Way on Guam.
John Toves DEMANDED to have an audience with Archbishop Apuron and made four concessions, which left no room for compromise: 1) to reinstate Monsignor James to the Cathedral, 2) to reinstate Father Paul as head of the Dededo parish, 3) to step down from his position as Archbishop of Guam, and 4) to take responsibility in the alleged sexual molestation of his cousin. Interestingly enough, these four concessions have no benefit to John Toves who lives in California, but it certainly benefits Tim Rohr who once received a paycheck from Monsignor James and even had the Church support his company.
Instead, the Archbishop intends to file a defamation lawsuit. This action alone is already a statement saying that the allegations are false and he is innocent of these charges. Yet, the jungle folks would like to hear the Archbishop say that he is innocent and that the allegation is false? My question is why? They are only going to say that he is a liar anyway.
Secondly, some jungle folks want Archbishop Apuron to step aside and allow Deacon Claros to investigate the alleged sexual molestation charges. And if he does and is found not guilty......what then? Surely, the jungle folks is not going to accept that verdict. Instead, they would accuse Deacon Claros of lying and covering up for the Archbishop because he walks in the Way. So, even if found innocent, the Archbishop would be damned by the jungle folks anyway. And they would simply find another way to remove him from his position. The defamation lawsuit is the only logical and reasonable path to take. The fact that the jungle folks are up in arms against this lawsuit shows that the Archbishop made the right decision in following sound legal advice.
As mentioned above, the four concessions (which John Toves calls his "Christmas wish") has no benefit to him because he lives in California; however, it does benefit Tim Rohr who resides on Guam.
According to Tim's public statements in his blog, he wants the Archbishop removed, and if Father Adrian were to be his successor....he has a back up plan that obviously involves John Toves. This sounds like a conspiracy had been brewing between the two since the beginning. Why is it important for Tim Rohr to choose the Archbishop he wants? Is it possible that Tim has a penchant desire to return to the days when the Church was giving him a salary and supporting his company? Tim's own statement can shed some light on that. According to Tim Rohr:
"Here's why I'm asking. As the vice-rector of the Cathedral, you have access to the books. You can see my paychecks, as measly as they are. But you don't know what those checks are for that are written to my company, do you?"
http://www.junglewatch.info/2014/09/fr-jucutan-is-this-you.html
We know that Tim Rohr was once under the payroll of Monsignor James. We also know that the Church has been supporting his company. However, what kind of accounting practice is this where checks are made out to Tim's company and Father Jucutan is unable to determine the items purchased from his company? According to Tim Rohr: "But you don't know what those checks are for that are written to my company, do you?" And the question is....... "why is that, Mr. Rohr?" Is this one of the reasons why the auditors say that the accounting practice is so bad that it was unable to conduct a proper audit?
Did Father Paul Gofigan and John Toves go to pay a visit to Our Lady of Camelin this night at 11.oopm?!! Yes, eleven o’clock at night! They were seen wandering and wandering around the Cathedral at this unearthly time of the night.
ReplyDeleteThings are becoming clearer and clearer by the hour. Why did Mr. Toves appear now after 32 years of absence? Why is the media making so much clamor about his coming? Is it the gay lobby? Is it the vindication of two priests? Or both combined?
My thought is that someone made himself a puppet and clown of the Jungle, in particular, a puppet and clown of Tim Rohr. This person came out of nowhere and will go back to nowhere exactly where he came from. This person has only hearsay and gossip at his disposal against the spiritual leader of the Catholic community at Guam. This person blew his nonsense up to look bigger than it is -- by the help of Tim Rohr and his pack of jackals in the anti-Catholic media.
ReplyDeleteArchbishop Apuron is the one appointed mediator of the Holy Spirit to the faithful on our island. He is above and beyond reproach by those simple minded adventurers whose only ability is mongering scandal and riding high on the ensuing controversy. What blindness and insensitivity to moral valor! But our Archbishop is protected by the Holy Spirit! His protection is coming through both the Church proper and the Neocatechumenal Way! If you do not believe me, just watch out what is going to happen with the nasty accusations and the nasty accusers, when the Holy Spirit finally takes charge and makes His impact on the events. Someone will be vindicated big time, just watch out!
My thought is also that this scandal has nothing to do with our beloved Neocatechumenal communities. Whatever will be the outcome of a lengthy legal litigation, this won't have any impact on the Way whatsoever! Why? Simply because all the allegations, as mad as false they are, have nothing to do with the Way. Whenever we are shaken, we are going to grow bigger and stronger. You cannot shake and break the communities because we belong to the plan of God, who will shake and break the world through us into a new shape and a new fashion according to His mighty will. Blessed be His name forever!
Dear "Ernie" (we know who you really are), have you read the Pope's comments from yesterday's morning homily? While you bang on about "Adult faith", whatever that means to you, the pope says: "“Only those whose hearts are like the young” are able to receive the revelation of God".
DeletePope Francis went on to comment on theology, saying "that those who do not do “this theology on their knees, humbly” will not understand anything."
Perhaps he should have said, those who do not do this "sitting"?
You try to be humorous, dear Anonymous, but you can't! Why? Because the Holy Spirit is not speaking from your mouth. Why? Because the Holy Spirit is not even talking in your heart. Or you simply do not listen to! Pray that when the Holy Spirit comes around this tiny island and manifests His awesome power for everyone, you won't be caught in mocking the Lord, His plan and therefore destroying your own salvation.
DeleteTell me, pray, what does this crazy brouhaha over there at the Jungle has to do with the Way? Your talking heads are going berserk over a notorious adventurer who will disappear at any time when he gets the heat. Lol, you have built your house on the sand. The wind blows here and there and your house will be no more. This is how the Spirit come around.
You are funny, still. You say you know who I am. Does it count anything for you, if you know it or not?! Don't be ridiculous! I also know who I am, but it has no particular benefit for me... The benefit is not in knowing one human being from the other. The benefit is in knowing the Lord only! Do you know Him? If you don't know Him, please, do not mock His Spirit!
Ernie writes:
DeleteThe benefit is not in knowing one human being from the other.The benefit is in knowing the Lord only! Where is the Lord, how do you know the Lord if not through others, what have they been teaching you in the community!!!!
Funny Ernie, you forgot the main and essential thing in Catholic Christianity, " Whatever you do the least of my brothers and sisters you do it to me.
Dear Isaias,
DeleteThe Lord is Jesus Christ. Although the Holy Spirit is in us, that does not mean that we are Jesus Christ. There is a difference between knowing me and knowing Christ.
Ernie, your claims about the Holy Spirit are vary questionable! How can you say the Holy Spirit supports you and the NeoCat? There is no evidence. You deny the the Holy Spirit in the history of the Church after Trent. The whole NeoCat is in denial! It is a crazy idea to deny the Holy Spirit in the Church acting as the 3rd person of the Holy Trinity God after Trent. Why do you say that? There is no difference before and after Trent, the Holy Spirit has always been with us, with all the faithful of the Catholic Church!
DeleteNow, if you are denying the Holy Spirit, therefore how can you say the same Holy Spirit supports Kiko and the Archbishop? Just tell me. Don't you think it is preposterous?! You cannot judge if the Holy spirit is talking in someone's heart or out of someone's mouth. Please, reconcile yourselves first with the Holy Spirit! Until then you just cannot have the presence of God through His Spirit in your NeoCat communities.
The charism of Arguello and the NeoCat is fake and fiction and nothing more, unless you truly humble yourself before the Holy Spirit and accept His work throughout the history.
Just like the Archbishop making himself a puppet of Giussepe Gennarini, ordaining only the priests that meet Gennarinis' approval every summer..How is Gennarini qualified to do this?
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 10:45 am,
DeleteIt was the Archbishop's choice to file a defamation lawsuit. Giussepe Gennarini was not even there. But there is Tim's statement saying that John Toves is his back up plan.
Dear Diana,
DeleteAnswer the question posed by 10:45 AM! The writer is talking about Giussepe approving the ordination for the men into the priesthood. Isn't this the job of the Vocational Director, Adrian Cristobal?
Dear Anonymous at 12:01 am,
DeleteWhere is his evidence? Does he have a recording?
Maybe there is a recording! You would like to know wouldn't you! Surprise!
DeleteDear Anonymous at 1:01 pm,
DeleteMAYBE???? That is a pretty big "Maybe." :)
I am the evidence Anonymous 12:01.
ReplyDeleteDear Isaias,
DeleteYou are not Catholic.
Isais your comments don't matter anymore cuz your not even Catholic.
DeleteYou need to find your spiritual self called discernment.
Hey Diana I think we have a spy in here because they posted the one about john toves and fr. Paul in the jungle and their standing behind fr.Paul and their still insisting that he's not gay and their denouncing their support of gay marriage
ReplyDeleteI find it very difficult to share a logical comment to mr. Isaias....jungle contributors on this site. Their comments and responses are so fragmented and very often not offering or deserving substantive or factual responses.
ReplyDeleteWhat they do offer are unsubstantiated accusations; sensational claims; ignorance of true faith which confirms their hidden adjenda. What is their adjenda? Who knows. I believe it is whatever satisfies their temporary feeling of...I am righteousness, I am smarter than thou attitude. Clearly shows their human rather than spiritual nature. They are never wrong in their eyes....never capable of accepting corrections...Thanks be to God that he loves all.
Anon 5:39PM have you seen Frenchie and Marilu's comments. Same story, it's pride.
ReplyDeleteLost in the jungle I suppose. We are not Saints ourselves but the events surrounding this "drama" have hidden motivations.....evil. What is the connection between rohr and benavente; toves and the capuchins; gofigan and his employee. Who knows? Funny how they manipulate the press to promote their adjenda, maybe its time for us to start digging ourselves and see how righteous rohr and his buddies truly are. hhhhhhmmm
ReplyDeleteThe connections are mind twisting: the characters: gofigan - toves - benavente - rohr - chuck white - efren - crisostomo - blockley - martinez - archdiocesan finance council - gay lobby - money. Their goal: bring down Archbishop. These guys will not operate unless they are funded. Who's the cash cow? Who is funding - ?????. Does anybody have an educated guess?
ReplyDeleteYes, we know who is funding the whole process. But we prefer not to mention names at this stage.
ReplyDeleteDiana, what Tim said here in his comment proves that you right about the money. He wants to go back to the way things were when the church paid him a salary and supported his business.
ReplyDeleteTimDecember 4, 2014 at 8:08 AM
The answer is quite simple. Ever since the Dianas started attacking me and my family, the donations have been pouring in to help fight back. Without the Dianas I don't think I would have received this much support. In fact, without the Dianas my blog would have never achieved the popularity it has. Every insult, every dig, every attack sends more people and more money to my blog. Thanks.
Dear Anonymous at 8:16 am,
DeleteYes, it has always been about money.
Tim Rohr is getting desperate and showing an extremely confused state of mind. No wonder, he made a pact with the devil, therefore his soul does not belong to him anymore. It belongs to the devil. Now, the devil make a whole lot of strange things, bringing the poor souls under its control to utter confusion and destruction. This is exactly what we see now at the Jungle blog.
ReplyDeleteHere is Tim Rohr's most recent explanation for his course of action: "The answer is very simple and it was recently given to us by Pope Francis: a priest attached to money and a priest who mistreats people" cannot be forgiven. So what is poor Tim saying here? He said that he instigated a defamation against the Archbishop as a punishment for being "attached to money" and "mistreating people".
Hey, hey, wait a minute! These changes are also false. But even if we assume (but never allow!) that these charges were true, you still cannot accuse anyone with sexual abuse without ground and without firm evidence! Can you hear me, Tim Rohr? Sexual abuse charges can be leveled only in order to mitigate the suffering of victims. This is the only legitimate reason. These charges cannot be leveled against anyone for "punishment"! The devil led you soul astray, Tim. This also shows that the abuse changes are completely fake, because these charges only substitute what Tim cannot achieve otherwise because of his mental and moral weakness.
Tim is only using this naive person as his puppet to make charges. The real reason is not and never to help any victim. Tim Rohr actually wants any possible victims to suffer even more! He does not care, because the devil blinded him toward the suffering of others that he causes to them. He is even blind to the suffering of his own family. Tim's only goal is destruction. But the devil is smart and he has already ensnared Timmy into the destruction of -- himself. Ouch what a blunder for him! This is going to enfold in the next couple of months.
Dear Ernie,
DeleteBefore John Toves came to Guam, he also spoke to Patty Arroyo. Tim Rohr has the John's interview with Jesse Lujan and Ray Gibson, but somehow he missed the interview with Patty Arroyo, which can be found on this weblink:
http://www.pacificnewscenter.com/pnc-k57-interviews/item/1018-john-toves-with-patti-arroyo
According to that Interview, John Toves admitted that the real reason he came out was to reinstate Monsignor James and Father Paul. It was not about his cousin who he claimed was sexually molested by the Archbishop. In fact, he admitted in this interview that he never communicated with his cousin about his plan to launch the allegations against the Archbishop. So, he was not even speaking on behalf of his cousin.
Thanks you, dear Diana! This was exactly my point. ;)
DeleteAll the Archbishop has to do is come out and say he's innocent....but he hasn't. Doesn't it make you wonder why Diana? Why is he hiding? Why won't he meet with John Toves? I can only think it's because he's guilty. What do you think?
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 7:57 pm,
DeleteWhenever the Archbishop comes out to speak, all the jungle did was call him a liar. What makes you think this time would be different? It is best for him to remain silent and have his lawyers complete the papers for the defamation lawsuit, so these papers can be served to John Toves.
Diana -- If he were truly innocent, what should he care about what the Jungle says? After all, it's just a hate blog isn't it?
DeleteDear Anonymous at 2:56 am,
DeleteWe all care because the jungle folks are still our Catholic brothers, and we desire unity and reconciliation. Unfortunately, they are adamant in removing the Archbishop. Bringing in a very serious criminal allegation such as sexual molestation is not something you ignore.
Two simple questions.
ReplyDeleteWho paid the airfare for John Toves to come to Guam?
If Tim Rohr is receiving money from different sources, as he has just claimed, will he declare the amount to the IRS? Perhaps Chuuk White can give him precious advice since he works at the Judiciary.
And by the way, dear Mr. White, I read somewhere that Federal Government frowns on its employees from participating in hate blogs. Jungle Watch is a hate blog.
Before any of these self-righteous ones who populate the Jungle, jump on me and accuse me of being hypocritical, please let them read some of the entries in that shameful blog and see the way they savagely attack anyone who disagrees with them.
For the sake of accuracy and to further the cause, can you please show the Federal Statute that says this? I would love to read it. Maybe white will no longer avail himself of the great technological advances contained in the Dist. Crt. in order to help the jungle. Isn't there a law that says you can't do that?
ReplyDeleteMy thoughts on this matter.... Something's very fishy with the Archbishop hiding from the allegations. He definitely has something to hide. Why don't you see this Diana?
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 11:13 am,
DeleteThe Archbishop already said that the allegations are false, but Tim Rohr is not satisfied with that. Tim wants the Archbishop to specifically say that he is innocent. So, look at who is trying to control the Archbishop.......even to the point of telling him exactly what he should say. Why don't you see this?
Trying to avoid the question again Diana. I didn't ask about Tim Rohr. The question is why won't the Archbishop meet with Mr. Toves? What is he afraid of? If he were innocent, he wouldn't hide. His actions are proving he is guilty.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 10:38 pm,
DeleteHe never hid. He already came out in public after he came back from Rome. He already said the allegations are false. What more do you want? How many times do you need to hear him say that the allegations are false? What part in that statement did you not understand?
So why won't he meet with Mr. Toves? If the Archbishop says the allegations are false, why hide from Mr. Toves?
DeleteDear Anonymous at 10:00 pm,
DeleteBecause Mr. Toves is only there for "show and tell" rather than having a serious talk with the Archbishop. If he was really serious, he would not be dragging the media with him. He brings the media with him so the entire conversation can be recorded for the jungle so they can make fun of the Archbishop.
Diana,
ReplyDeletedo you know why tim rohr is so invested in removing the archbishop ? It would be interesting to find out what is driving so much vitriol.
Dear Anonymous at 1:01 am,
DeleteAll I know was that Tim Rohr used to work for the Church and that the Church was also supporting his business. Now he is no longer working for the Church. His bookstore is no longer at the Church, and I doubt that the Church is supporting his business. Tim used to write in the Umatuna under "View from the Pew." I used to read his articles in the Umatuna. I do not see him writing for the Umatuna anymore. If I am not mistaken, I think his last article was sometime in April, 2013. If he had a falling out with the Archbishop, it appears to be sometime around 2013.