There appears to be some contradiction in the jungle. According to Tim Rohr, Jonathan Bordallo was not kicked out, but left on his own. Rohr wrote (the bold is mine):
I've been hearing that Jonathan Bordallo is saying that I kicked him out of the meeting last week in Agana. For the sake of his personal credibility I sure hope Mr. Bordallo is not saying that and that others just have the story wrong.
As everyone who was there knows - at least 60 people - I invited Mr. Bordallo to the front to give his speech and then I sat down. As he began to speak about Msgr. James I asked him if he had spoken with Msgr. James. When he said no, the crowd began protesting.
One attendee stood up and said that we should all be thankful to Mr. Bordallo because "we just learned more about the real problem in 5 minutes listening to him than we did in listening to Tim for an hour."
Mr. Bordallo then left without my help.
I am posting this here because if my account is not true then I have just damaged my credibility and the credibility of this blog forever.
http://www.junglewatch.info/2015/03/tim-rohr-kicked-me-out.html
And then the very next day, Tim Rohr wrote (the bold is mine):
Ms. Cottman, take Pius and go! before the people rise up and throw you out like they did to Mr. Bordallo last week. Go find some place else to destroy and let us put ourselves back together. Oh, and give us back our hotel on your way out.
http://www.junglewatch.info/2015/03/pat-cottman-archbishop-apuron-is-failure.html
So, which is it???? Did Jonathan Bordallo left on his own or was he thrown out?? So much for the jungle's credibility. They never could get their stories straight. At least, we do not change our story. When we say that we received oral instructions, that has not changed.
Good One Diana! Expose the Truth!
ReplyDeleteI hope the sensible Guam Catholics realize just how much unstable this guy is. This is what he has to say about the USCCB. I think we should send every single U.S. Bishop and Cardinal these words...
"Going to just use the Latin from now on and the hell w the corrupt USCCB"
-taken from the Catholic Apollo facebook page.
Also, why dont we send those words to EWTN and show what Rohr really thinks about the U.S.Clergy. I dont think they would like to be connected to such a person.
If I were Jonathan Bordallo I would have asked Rohr if he had spoken directly to Father Pius or Pat before making all these public accusations against the NCW on Guam.
Dear Anonymous at 2:01 am,
DeleteIt was actually a commenter who caught it and brought it to my attention.
Archbishop Thomas Wenski, Archbishop of Miami, preached the homily at the ordination of Bishop Peter Baldacchino, Miami’s 10th auxiliary bishop. The ordination took place March 19, 2014 at St. Mary Cathedral. This is an excerpt of his homily
Delete“Peter, you have followed an itinerary of Catholic formation – a work of the New Evangelization – known as the Neocatechumenal Way, which Blessed John Paul II deemed “valid for our society and for our times.” Pope Benedict XVI described “The Way” as a “precious instrument” that contributes, “with new impetus and ardor, to the radical and joyful rediscovery of the gift of baptism.” As you walked this itinerary you discovered – in the proclamation of the Kerygma – the Evangelii Gaudium, the Joy of the Gospel. As a bishop you must continue to share that joy with all – as you recognized in the choice of your episcopal motto, Ubi Dominus, ibidem Laetitia (Wherever God is, there is joy).”
Why are some people shocked that Archbishop Apuron walks in the Neocatechumenal Way? I do not understand. They attack him on this point as if he is doing a crime!!!
amusing here because your post about Bordallo is a construction of fiction. As the original author wrote the people threw him out- not literally but he left because the audience was upset with his remark and voiced it. so Bordallo walked off. I was there.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 11:37 am,
DeleteI was not the one who wrote about Jonathan Bordallo. That was Tim Rohr who wrote about him. So, which one is it??? Did Bordallo walked off on his own (as Tim Rohr said) or was he thrown out (as Tim Rohr said). Both cannot be correct. The jungle has lost its credibility.
Is Tim Rohr Catholic? A Catholic is someone following Jesus Christ who taught us to be charitable always. Listen to this venom: “Either the Archbishop is simply evil and he must be removed immediately or he is sick and must be removed immediately. Which do you prefer?” March 14th, 2015 on Jungle Watch.
ReplyDeleteTim Rohr must be seething with anger because the Pope spoke so well of the Neocatechumenal Way. Poor Tim! He never imagined that the Pope will come out with such strength in favor of the Neo-catechumenal Way.
ReplyDeleteAt the very start, he said, “I CONFIRM YOUR CALL, I SUPPORT YOUR MISSION AND I BLESS YOUR CHARISM.”
And at the end: "HOW MUCH JOY YOU GIVE US WITH YOUR PRESENCE AND YOUR ACTIVITY!” - said Blessed Pope Paul VI during the very first audience with you. I ALSO MAKE THESE WORDS MY OWN AND ENCOURAGE YOU TO MOVE FORWARD, entrusting you to the Blessed Virgin Mary who inspired the Neocatechumenal Way. May she intercede for you with her divine Son.
MY DEARLY BELOVED, may the Lord accompany you. Go forth, with my Blessing.”
Archbishop is right after all in being so supportive of the Way. He follows the Pope, like any good Catholic!
This proves how uncatholic the timmies are. We in the way need to take over all the parishes by force. This typhoon is a sign that our lord and savior is unhappy and the Holy Father has encouraged us in the way to continue with our mission. Let's save our island first. Let's take over all the parishes! Let the way lead. Let's lead the way!
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 8:08 am,
DeleteThey are still our Catholic brothers, despite that they are misguided and fallen. There is nothing we can do except to pray for them.
@Anon 8:08...Please tell me you're playing around. Although I may not be a member of the NCW, I have no ill feelings. However, I take offense with your comment. I pray that you were only kidding.
Delete"We in the way need to take over all the parishes by force."
Lord help you and your misguided thoughts.
~GSN
To GSN, what 11:19 PM said is true, although he forgot to insert that Baldachiino was asked if he was ready to show mercy and compassion. He was also told that he was to be a bishop not for himself, but for the church.
DeleteI agree with you gsn. I do walk in a community: what anon@8:08 said is ludicrous! As if God could be bound in one group. I love the Way, but the church is not just the way. What Rohr and his minions demand is total sameness in the church. If we advocated that everyone be in the way, we would be as bad as rohr.
DeleteTo anon @6:19. You forgot to insert is that those are the standard question during a bishop's investiture. All bishop candidates are asked those questions. Why do you single them out?
Delete"Our hotel"????? Who's? Rohr's Guamanian Church? Last I checked it was a diocesan seminary. The fact that he wants to convert it back to a hotel shows what little value he gives to the Catholic Church. The whole world, not to mention Guam, has a shortage of priests and he wants to destroy a seminary. It's equivalent to wishing the church to commit suicide.
ReplyDeleteMaybe the best thing is to go to the fiesta at the RMS seminary and talk to AAA a lively conversation to clear any miscommunication...Jungle folks let us go to the RMS fiesta tomorrow. Diana be there. It would help you show your "true" self.
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 10:36 am,
DeleteIt is already a known fact that whenever the Archbishop gives an answer, the jungle simply calls him a "liar." So, he remains silent because you are not interested in hearing what he has to say.
The jungle favorite words Are liar. liar liar coward coward coward
Deletewe need written proof of the documents being questioned. If you show it all this division will cease. Why are you making it hard for us here. Is it that hard to produce, Diana?
DeleteDo you have it or not. Los Angeles communities do not have it either...was wondering why?
Maybe Philippines, we need to ask the head catechist, Luigi and Bertilla.
Yes, their favorite words are liar and coward because these two words reflect who Tim Rohr is.
DeleteDiana - Not everyone here is from the "jungle". Archbishop Apuron has a responsibility to shepherd ALL his flock so you cannot use the excuse that he remains silent because we're not interested in hearing what he has to say. He cannot continue to remain silent. If he can not longer fulfill his duties, then he should step down. But we all know why he can't or won't do it. Because if he steps down, the NCW here will come crashing down and that won't be a good thing for Kiko would it? The NCW big-wigs need him to stay in until they can be sure the next archbishop of Guam will also be neo, hence the destruction of Msgr Benavente, who was a sure candidate to be the next archbishop. The pieces of the puzzle are coming together, Diana, and more and more people are starting to see the picture.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 1:16 am,
DeleteIf they are not from the jungle, then they act like they are from the jungle. Why? Because the motto of the jungle is not to believe even after the answer is given to them and to continue asking the same questions over and over and over.
1. They ask why did the Archbishop remove Father Paul? The answer is because of disobedience. And they still continue to ask the same question, thinking that he was removed because the Archbishop had the ulterior motive to put the NCW in the Dededo parish. The letter that the Archbishop sent to Father Paul did not mention the NCW at all. Do you know who actually mentioned the NCW and came up the idea that it was because the Archbishop wanted to place the NCW in the Dededo parish???? It was Patty Arroyo who first invented the idea and Tim Rohr took off with it.
2. They ask why Monsignor James was removed. The answer was because of financial mismanagement, and they did not believe him even when the Internal Review was published.
3. They ask the Archbishop why he gave away the seminary in Yona. His answer was he did not give it away. The title of the seminary is under the Archdiocese of Agana, and he is in control. They still ask the same question to this day. In fact, CCOG is exploring the possibility of suing the Archbishop to get the seminary back. Nevermind the fact that he already told them that the RMS seminary is under the Archdiocese of Agana.
And so on and on and on and on.
Then why Diana does the archbishop want the Santa Bernardita in Yigo to be part of Santa Barbara parish. We know there is a community there. Why not make it part of parish of Yigo...why the insistance of moving it to Santa Barbara? It isa very suspicious.
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 1:58 pm,
DeleteCan you explain where you got this information?
AAA pastoral visitation at Sta. Barbara.... since Sta Barbara does not want the NCW...i guess the back door will be used to bring in the NCW. You can ask the Archbishop to confirm.
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 9:00 pm,
DeleteIf you heard the Archbishop say this, then praise be to God. The NCW can soon help some of the youths and families in Dededo.
Diana, no way because you are going to divide the parish. Is this what NCW wants. Take over parishes and restructuring it and isolating or alienating the rest of the God's people. It is very divisive, NCW. Can you not see.
ReplyDeleteArchbishop Villegas of Pangasinan put a 5 year moratorium not to have catechesis because of the same problem.
Dear Anonymous at 10:50 am,
DeleteThe only one who see division is you. There are many organizations in the Catholic Church of which the NCW is one of them. That is a fact. You do not have a problem with the Christian Mothers, the Legion of Mary, or the Cursillios because they are Catholic. Nevermind the fact that you are not a member of any of those organizations. You also need to start changing your attitude and thinking by recognizing that the NCW is also Catholic. Nevermind the fact that you are not a member of the NCW.
Diana, 'you have eyes but you don't see, you have ears but do not hear,'' What more do you need to see and hear that the division exists here in the island brought about by NCW.
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 12:44 pm,
DeleteThe NCW has a mission. We are to carry out the Gospels everywhere as Christ instructed His Church. We have mission families and itinerants doing that already. Today, statistics show that Catholicism has increased especially in the continents of Asia and Africa.......thanks to the New Evangelization.
The Devil is the one who causes division, and he hates that Catholicism is increasing worldwide. And the Devil works so hard to stop the NCW. It is not the NCW who is doing anything to the Traditional Latin Mass Catholics. Thank goodness that the Vatican delegation has finally done something to straighten out the divided clergy. I am sure that they were told to respect the hierarchy of the Church and the Bishop who ordained them.
Diana @1:42pm, I don't think it's the division with the traditional Latin Mass Catholics that Anon @12:44 is referring to. It's what has happened with regular Catholics like the parishioners at San Vicente/San Roke, the Cathedral Basilica, (and others) -- wherein many of the long time parishioners left to join another parish because of the changes in their churches, feeling their new priests favour those in the Way over those who do not Walk, etc.
DeleteI have heard not all churches are divided, though. Thank goodness, the people of Asan have been strong, and also the good priest there (Neo) is wise enough to recognize the importance of keeping them informed and even aware of parish expenditures. I just wish more priests were like him!
Dear Anonymous at 4:00 pm,
DeleteWho told them to leave? Was it their choice to leave? The Catholic Church have always been filled with statues, icons, and mosaics, and they decided to leave because new icons were put up? Is that really a good and legitimate reason to leave?
Diana @6:38--Nobody told them to leave, but they apparently weren't made to feel comfortable staying, either! Not just for the statues, icons, mosaics---but for not agreeing to participate in the Neo sponsored activities, questioning expenses/practices, not approving schedules for funerals, etc., etc. (Many previously regular operations at a church on Guam.)
DeleteAnd there was no effort to try and prevent them from leaving, either--more like a sigh of relief. Is this the new Catholic Way?? "If you don't like it leave!"? I shudder to think what will happen if more of the aggressive Neo priests (unlike the one at Asan) are placed in all the churches on Guam....where would the traditional Catholics go?
Kick out some Catholics, and evangelize new ones to replace....smh
Dear Anonymous at 8:47 am,
DeleteDon't you think you are exaggerating? HOW were they made to feel uncomfortable? Please be specific? Did they threaten them or their jobs, for example? Explain HOW they were made uncomfortable.
There was no effort to try and prevent them from leaving? What do you want us to do? We are being criticized for forcing people to join the Way. Now we are being criticized for not forcing people to stay?? The fact that we make no effort in preventing them from leaving goes to show that we respect the choices people make regardless of whether they join the Way or not. It is them that said that they do not want us. We never said that we do not want them.
Diana @8:47-- Don't be silly....of course no one was forced to leave! Your example is ludicrous.... I listed a few of the ways people were uncomfortable with their parish and felt they needed to leave.
DeleteIt's not about force...it's about the attitude of "take it or leave it".
And, again, I ask--what if all churches were to be under Neo priests? Where would they go--IF you still "respect the choices people make".
Dear Anonymous at 9:15 am,
DeleteDid you hear anyone from the NCW get up and tell the people in the Mass to either "take it or leave it????? Again, be specific. When you say, it is their "attitude", you need to explain in concrete terms without putting in your assumed judgment. Did you actually HEAR anyone in the Way get up at the podium during Mass when they invited the people to join the Way say "Take it or leave it" to the congregation? Please be specific.
On the other hand, we know that some people have expressed the "attitude" that they do not want us. The people in Yona, for example, have written a petition expressing their "attitude" that they do not want the NCW. That is the concrete evidence that we have showing their "attitude" that we are not wanted. Now, do you have any concrete evidence showing HOW they were made to be uncomfortable by the NCW??? Do you have any concrete evidence showing this so-called "attitude" that you are accusing us of?
So defensive and must be getting irritated....5 question marks! Of course no one got up in Mass to make the proclamation. As I mentioned in my first post, it is a collection of things: funeral scheduling issues, inquiries into expenses, non-partcipation in Neo activities, etc. Where once people and activities were accommodated, now they are not. That will be as specific as I will get-- suffice it to say that each of those has had a family member experience.
DeleteAnd as for Yona, I guess they were just being pro-active. What they don't want is for a Neo priest to be assigned there and to experience what they have been hearing from their family members in Agana, Barrigada, Santa Rita, and Ordot Chalan Pago. They don't want to have to leave their beloved parish.
Dear Anonymous at 12:07,
DeleteThe five question marks is not an indication of defensiveness. So, do not make any assumptions. In truth, two or three question marks means "HUH." More than three question marks is actually my way of say "DUH." :-)
Anonymous, you still have not shown any concrete evidence showing HOW the NCW made the parishioners uncomfortable. Apparently, the source of their discomfort comes from either their jealousy or hatred of the Way. If not, then explain in concrete terms exactly HOW the NCW made them to be uncomfortable. I already showed you concrete evidence that they do not want around. Their "attitude" was expressed in the petition that they signed, which stated that they do not want us in their parish. So, now it is your turn. Show HOW we made them uncomfortable.
And please do not give me any one phrase answers like "non-participation in Neo activities" make them uncomfortable.. When I say "explain", I am not looking for one phrase answers. Explain HOW " in detail and with evidence how "not participating in Neo-activities" make them uncomfortable.
Delete
ReplyDeleteDiana. Why was Luis Camcho parked on a car in a quiet place with the girl? Even you must see aronlem with this. if you are a mother of a teenage girl how would you feel,to know that your daugher was in that car. As mothers, parents protect children. Should you be a mother we think the same regardless of what side we on. Moherhood is universal. Protect our children from any potential danger.
Dear Anonymous at 10:49 am,
DeleteFirst of all, I do not know what Luis Camacho was doing sitting in the car with the girl. But I assure you that if this was my teenage daughter, I would be disappointed and upset with BOTH of them. I would be upset with the priest for placing himself in a compromising situation. And if the priest had a crush on my daughter, I would be disappointed if he were to give in to temptation.
As for my daughter, I would be very disappointed and upset with her as well for putting herself in a compromising situation or for pursuing a priest if she happens to have a crush on that priest. I have always taught my daughters NEVER to go out with married men, and priests are married. They are married to the Church.
Thank you Diana 10.49am for this balanced answer. Expected you to say you wanted your daughter to date Fr.Luis Camacho.
ReplyDelete