This is old news because I had already published the information previously. Nevertheless, in light of some of the comments in the previous thread, it is important to get the point across that the NCW does not view women as inferior, but equal to men, with the same human dignity. I am sure that many people in the NCW remembers Pat Cottman. She is a very strong speaker. The late Carmen Hernandez was also a very strong speaker. Women were actually the first ones to spread the good news. It was the women who went to the Apostles announcing that Christ was risen.
But with different roles!!!!
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 11:41 pm,
DeleteExactly. God created men and women equal with the same human dignity. But he also created them with different roles. Being different does not mean they are not equal. It simply means they are different.
I truly wonder if women in the NCW are equal to men? Not in my part of the world.
DeleteGod is still speaking
Dear God is still speaking,
DeleteCan you elaborate more on you comment?
Diana they are trying to make it into a political issue
Delete@AnonymousFebruary 20, 2018 at 11:24 AM - Why don't you see for yourself. Celebrate with us in Eucharist, try it for 6 mos and see for yourself.
DeleteGino - Sinajab
"Not in my part of the world."
DeleteOne may say, in general, that Gum women are kept in a pre-modern state of affairs. Although they started to walk toward but have not reached the age of consciousness yet that is characteristic in Europe and North America. Guam women have to wake up and find themselves in the modern world of the 21st century! Hello, we are not living in the Middle Ages!
This is even more true in the Catholic Church that showed the example to all Christian denominations by turning to the direction of a spirit of modernity at the Vatican II Council. The liberating effects of Vatican II are still reverberating. This gives us much hope that the call of the modern age will be heard and the ensuing spiritual freedom will re-juvenile our faith.
For those who would not know: "femina" is not feminism. Femina is the female principle of the world. We all know the story of Gaia, the ancient Greek earth mother, who according to mythology produced all the life and vegetation we see today.
Dear Femina,
DeleteGuam is a matrilineal society, in which women are more dominant and have more rights than men. In ancient Guam, women were the only ones who voted and owned property. The women were in charge of the home and the children. When the Spanish and Americans came, Chamorro men started to gain more rights. The NCW in Guam teaches that husbands are the heads of the household and the wives are the heart of the home. This is what the Catholic Church teaches, and it can be a struggle for many Chamorro women. The indigenous people of Guam call themselves Chamorros.
That’s true. In my community, I can still see the dominance of the wife in the marriage. I know that many of the women in my community struggle with this cuz it’s something new to them.
DeleteThen you have to ask yourself if this is good or bad. Answers will vary. Every woman has a right for self-actualization in her own way. This should go beyond biological function. You know that your society or community is in a pre-modern state of affairs if women's self-actualization is exhausted by biological function.
DeleteA modern woman can have several kids, own or adopted, but her life should not be exhausted in the role of housewife. Celebrity women with good moral standing can be the role models here. It is even more true in Catholic families. When you want your mate to stay home all her life to cook and feed the babies, then you reduce her to a limited existence.
I recommend for reading Maslow's hierarchy with self-actualization as a right of every human being on the top.
http://changingminds.org/explanations/needs/maslow.htm
Dear Femina, if by self-actualization you mean to realize one's full potential as a woman then I have to ask what this "full potential" can be, beyond being a good wife and mother. Some girls think showing a lot of their skin in their school of workplace is true "self-actualization".
DeleteYou talk about celebrities as role models, many of whom wear the kind of dresses that do not qualify to cover even the most necessary parts of their bodies! Is this the self-actualization you are promoting?
Dear Femina,
DeleteI checked out you link. Here are some thoughts just off the top of my head.
Maslow was into finding strategies for management and productivity. In other words he was interested in how we can help people be the most productive in the economic world. What you call self-actualization, and what you mean by it I don’t know, he refers to it as realizing maximum potential as a member of the economic society. So for a woman to be self-actualized she needs to
1. Make money
2. Figure out herself or her management how to get her to make the most money. How to be productive.
I am a woman. I do not consider my defining trait to be how productive I am. I define myself in light of revelation. Which means that the business I do, and I am very successful, does not define who I am. I am defined by the relationship with God which moves and progresses everyday in the measure that I renounce my ego and follow his will. So self-actualization for me is to deny my will. Which is the opposite of what manslow defines as self-actualization. Whether a woman is a wife and mother or a woman is alone, and if she works or not, these are secondary to her becoming a Christian that is a sign of god’s love for the world and is happy. My happiness is not dependant on what I do but on who I am.
I would recommend you read Edith stein on woman. She says all women, whether they are mothers or not, need to discover maternity as the intrinsic trait. So for a mother to be a mother is the highest form of being who she is. For a woman with no children she too has to discover her maternity by serving others. Neither cases exclude being educated or working in high powered job because the woman cannot define herself according to those lines but according to God’s will. And god has given us a uterus. Used or not, we are called to give life not money.
NB
Dear Femina
DeleteI have to say that if you look at history, judeo-christian revelation on family roles is the only successful family nucleus in history. When the mother takes on the role of father and mother the result is always catastrophic. The first result is that fathers loose their role int he family. As it stand the mother already has the most power and authority in the family, if the mother does not give the father the authority, because she is more closely linked to the children it is easy for her to overthrow the father. In fact this is what happens in most cultures with a matriarchy. When this happens the father becomes less then nothing and so he turns to alcoholism or other forms of escape, or he turns towards adultery.
God revealed the perfect objective family nucleus in which each member as an equally important role. The result of matriarchy is always the destruction of society. There is a reason why the Jewish people as well as Christians as a society have existed for over 2000 years. Simply put "IT WORKS"!.
If you want to turn towards the sciences and psychology. According to studies done on families, economically speaking, a 2 family traditional home is the most healthy home for a child. It is the number 1 help for both morality and a healthy financial future.
The number 1 reason for poverty in the United States for example is single parent households. Usually what produces single parent households is matriarchy. The reason is because when the father has no role in the family, except to make money for the mother to spend, in other words he has no say on how to raise children and what is right and wrong (which is always the case under matriarchy) he becomes nothing and no longer sees and point of staying in the family since he becomes nothing to his wife and his children.
Judeo-Christian culture has revealed the father as being the head of household even though the mother has more authority from a psychological point of view. The mother is the one who gives the father the authority from behind the scene. This provides the perfect balance of the law (what is right and wrong) shown through the father and the mercy (when you mess up) shown through the mother. Just like the holy trinity reflects the family. The father (law) the son (mercy and forgiveness) the holy spirit the children. This is the trinity in the family as presented by St. John Paul II.
Dear Anonymous and NB, yes I take self-actualization as a realization of one's full potential as a woman! This entails much more than following or not following a dress code. Of course, in Catholic context I prefer morally decent forms of self-actualization.
DeleteWhile Maslow developed his original theory in an economy-related framework, it has passed over boundary lines ever since then and became part of psychology's identification of human needs. As Diana wrote, in the Ancient Chamorro society, women owned the properties. It makes sense, because then claim of descendants for that property cannot be challenged by some illegitimate offspring. We can trace back easily the descendants of a mother, but the same for fathers might be more difficult.
There is nothing wrong for a woman to pursue and enjoy material wealth. Successful business practices may follow the strictest religious prescriptions. The key is moral correctness. Denying one' ego might be a way of self-actualization. But you also have to look what is entailed in one's ego. Ego is not necessarily and not entirely of evil. It could be a powerful source of energy and social action. Ego becomes evil when it overrides the moral code.
I love Edith Stein who was a nun. I also love Simone Weil and Dorothy Day who demonstrated the deep social dimensions of faithful Catholic involvement in women's movements. One may also mention the suffragettes. These are all superb examples of women self-actualization.
The Judeo-Christian family model prefers male dominance in family matters. It is not unique, you see the same in Muslim or Japanese families for that matter. I have a little problem with this. If one finds her full potential in being an obedient wife and a mother, I have nothing against it. However, self-actualization is a colorful experience, so rich as mother nature herself! Vegetation is booming, as a consequence of nature's diversity. Now, the same diversity is also at work in the spirit of femina.
If a woman finds her self-actualization in a career, in social activism, in entertainment industry or arts, in education or politics, etc. this also should be accepted as an exploration of her full potential as woman. Our Mother Mary had one child only and she devoted her life to raise this one single child in the best possible ways. You see that her incredible motherly power, the true spirit of the femina made her kid the Son of Man, the character of a Savior in the Catholic faith.
Dear Femina,
DeleteHaving ONLY women to own property is discriminatory. It puts the woman ahead and in front of the man, which is what the Catholic Church is against. Also, I am beginning to suspect that you are Joanne disguised as Femina.
Dear Diana, I did not say Chamorros should return to the ancient practice of women owning properties. I only said it made sense in its own time in alleviating inheritance disputes.
DeleteAs about Joanne Santos, her Catholic blog is quite interesting. Especially that some blog commenters also publish there. However, I find her Marian devotion too much of a limited nature and not a universal self-actualization model. It is okay if it works for her, but most women would not accept prayer as a realization of one's best potential as a woman!
I picked up her example of the Mother Mary as a single mother, because I like it. It is especially fitting for Catholic women who tend to limit their self-protection. Regarding the Marian title of the Queen of Heaven, I guess Joanne overuses it. We call this title in mystical context only. If there would be some tension between you and Joanne, I am not into that kind of things as I never take sides in skirmishes.
Dear Femina,
DeleteI take it then that you gave no problems with the Catholic teaching that husbands are heads of the house and the wives are the heart of the home?
No problem if a woman accepts that as her way of self-actualization in a Catholic family. I absolutely respect that. However, if a woman chooses other means of self-actualization, even as a Catholic, then that should be respected, as well.
DeleteI would really watch out with Maslow and his neo-Freudian secular personality theories. His existential psychology focuses on how individual becomes independent and autonomous self fulfilment is seen as Basic goal of human life. For Christians personality is fulfilled is self giving love. I would suggest to read more JP2 theology of the body and his works on Personalism.
DeleteDear Femina,
DeleteA female Catholic should always follow the teachings of the church even if it goes against what she perceives to be her self-actualization. In other words, as a Catholic, she must accept the fact that her husband is head of the household and she is the heart of the home. She must accept the fact that women cannot be priests.
Dear Femina at 9:59
DeleteThis is where you are in error. As Catholics we believe in God. If we believe in God we believe that there is one objective truth. In other words all can achieve happiness and fulfillment through this one objective truth independent of subjective idolatries. Self-fulfillment is already an anti-christian ideal since it is following one's own desires in order to fulfill an idolatric sense of happiness which objectively (this means according to what God has revealed) just doesn't exist. In other words your premise is false so the answer you are giving is false.
According to Christian revelation this sense of finding self-fulfillment is caused by original sin and is called concupiscence. It is caused, according to St. Paul, by our fear of death. Men has sinned and cut with God so he has experienced death or the meaninglessness of life. This experience has created a hole in us that propels us to find self-fulfillment and happiness. However this self-fulfillment can only be found in loving God and knowing his love. As the fathers of the church say, as well as the saints. All other agendas or ideals, or career paths or anything really is vanity of vanities. It is an exercise in futility. So what is left is objective truth. Under this objective truth women best fulfills this path of loving God in the uniqueness of being a mother. This can even be seen in psychological studies in which single women over 40 who have no children and are single even though they have chosen career paths all suffer from depression. This is an actual study. SO what you are saying, even if you are referring to the ideas of another philosopher is still just idolatric nonsense guided by the lie of concupiscence.
Judeo-Christian marriage is not patriarchal or tyrannical. It gives each individual his rightful role and treats each individual with repect, freedom and love. Always presenting objective truth with mercy and love. Feminist want to force men to be their slaves. This is what we see constantly in their rhetoric, which is why men are backlashing and we have new movements such as "mgtow - men going their own way" etc. This is why single people are becoming more and more. Only under christianity does one reject his idolatric sense of happiness (after experiencing the love of God) in order to selflessly love the other. This is to be imitator of Christ who not only abandoned all idolatries of careers, happiness etc but even his own life in order to love those who where killing him.
In John 10:10 Jesus came into the world so that all peoples will experience the fullness of life. "I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full." Self fulfillment is the promise of Christ, fullness of life in all its aspects (material, spiritual, psychological, emotional, psychical).
DeleteTo be imitator of Christ is that you don't settle for anything less. The Jesuits call it Magis. You are called to Divinity as the Eastern Fathers and Mothers would say. Jesus came so that humanity will be divinized. That is the Incarnation.
God is Still Speaking
God is Still Speaking
DeleteAgreed, I am anon from the post right above you.
Self-fulfillment can be achieved only in Christ who redeems in us concupiscence and our slavery to death though his death (he enters willingly into what we cannot) and his resurrection (God raises him up to show that death and sin is destroyed).
By this we can share in his divinity. This is happiness, not fulfillment as a feminist. Not fulfillment in career. Not in pleasure, or family, or anything materially. But that we are able to share in his nature and give up all that freely to love the other. By this the image of God is restored in us. The image that was lost through Adam and sin is restored. Adam was the man of flesh in Christ we are a new creation.
--IntelTheist
Well said, IntelTheist and God is still speaking.
DeleteAs I suggested earlier, the moral correctness of the femina action must be maintained and followed under all circumstances. I told the story of Jael from the Book of Judges. Please, read.
DeleteBeing current with Jesus is kept through prayer and personal choice following the Jesus Principle: "Whatever you do, do it with Jesus!" The Lord validates your self-actualization efforts by guiding you through His commands.
I still don't feel I can aim for divinity as a human being. If God wanted me to be divine, He would have created me to be one.
Dear Diana, I agree with you that a Catholic woman "must accept the fact that women cannot be priests". Although this hasn't been in the scope of the discussion yet, I surely believe that a church has every right to regulate consecration among its ranks. As long as Catholics believe women should not be priests, I cannot say anything against it.
DeleteDear Femina,
DeleteChrist came down as man. By becoming man, he shared in our humanity and in doing so, we can share in his divinity. According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
CCC 460 The Word became flesh to make us "partakers of the divine nature":"For this is why the Word became man, and the Son of God became the Son of man: so that man, by entering into communion with the Word and thus receiving divine sonship, might become a son of God." "For the Son of God became man so that we might become God." "The only-begotten Son of God, wanting to make us sharers in his divinity, assumed our nature, so that he, made man, might make men gods."
One reason Christ instituted the Eucharist is so that we can become one with God. When we eat his Body and drink his Blood, we become one with him so that we can even say that the Blood of Christ literally flows in our veins.
Diana, when I say I do not aim for the divine, I mean women should not be goddesses. We don't need physical power over men. What we need is peace, freedom from imposition and a simple life following our spiritual call for actualizing our best potentials as women. This spirit is witnessed in the Bible, as well.
DeleteThe spirit of femina has been present in the history of the Jewish people from its onset. I like the story of the heroic woman Jael, related to the judge Deborah:
"Most blessed of women be Jael,
the wife of Heber the Kenite,
of tent-dwelling women most blessed."
(Judges 5:24)
Jael lured the mighty and cruel Sisera, the general of the enemy Jabin’s army into her tent and while the giant was sleeping she drove a tent peg through his temple, into his skull. Jael showed the power of femina that overcomes male violence against women manifest during war. Sisera's marauders enslaved women for their own pleasure! “Are they not finding and dividing the spoil? — A girl or two for every man?"
The Bible is supporting the spirit of femina by empowering our fight against the dominance of the wicked! Among men you'll find the reliable ones just as well as the scoundrel.
Dear Femina,
DeleteWhat we (and everyone) need is Jesus Christ. Jael was able to do what she did simply because she had God with her. With God....everything. Without God....nothing.
Femina
DeleteDivinity is what we as Christians strive for. God already made us in his image, according to the fathers of the Church we destroyed the image (divinity) of God in us through original sin. God did not make us mindless divine puppets, he gave us free will so that we freely choose this. In other words we where created in his divinity from the beginning. We just destroyed that image in original sin and Christ redeems it (he is the only one that can).
Till we attain that again in Christ we are always unfulfilled because our natural nature was to be his image the image of Christ.
Also I don't understand what "everything you do, do it with Christ means". I know Christ died to love the enemy and that is the image of God we desire and is given freely through Christ.
--IntelTheist
I understand that in Catholic context divinity of man means sonship of God. But this is misleading as the Son of Man is the title of one single earthly person, Jesus. What is unique, is not for everyone, is it? For one, I am among those Catholics who do not desire sonship just the same way as I do not desire to be goddess either. I keep my life simple and uncomplicated. As creation, my desire is to fulfill my full potential as creation, not as creator.
DeleteConsidering truth, we consider the principle of one single truth valid in the process of learning about nature. This is what philosophers call epistomology. In the everyday life of our existence, the principle of diverse truths is considered valid, because most of what said is opinion and not objective truth.
God created us colorful beings, both in body and soul! We should accept ourselves as we are.
Dear Femina,
DeleteYou stated: "For one, I am among those Catholics who do not desire sonship just the same way as I do not desire to be goddess either."
So, essentially you are saying that you are not interested in eternal life with God in Heaven?
You also stated: "God created us colorful beings, both in body and soul! We should accept ourselves as we are."
God did not create us as colorful beings. Nowhere in the Bible does it say this. We were created in God's image and likeness. We are God's children. We are his sons and daughters. That is the truth.
If you cannot see yourself as a child of God created in his image as the Catholic Church teaches, then please take your philosophy somewhere else.
Dear Anonymous, "everything you do, do it with Jesus" means you don't leave him out of your everyday life. In Christian context, you wake up with prayer, you give thanks for the food you eat, you perform your daily tasks and chores with an eye of your mind on Jesus: what would he tell you, what would he do? You go to sleep with prayer. Etc.
DeleteEven more important, you invite Jesus into your life to be your guide and reference point. As a Catholic, you make your big decisions with asking approval from him in prayer. It is between you and Jesus validating your self-actualization efforts. You cannot and don't want to realize your full potential as a woman without Jesus. This is a commitment to your faith.
Dear Diana, of course, we are children of God. My understanding was that that divinity means sonship, according to Catholic teaching. Sonship looks to me a theologically more complicated notion than being a child. The Son of Man title is unique in the Scriptures reserved to Jesus. But I might be wrong.
DeleteWhile I respect philosophers, I don't aim to be one. Philosophers typically impose their thoughts on reality, including people. I see this as a male endeavor. Females are just fine with understanding without imposing. There is a reason there are not so many women among philosophers!
God in the Bible has many sides. He is a mighty creator, a thorough craftsman. He is a strict ruler who expels Adam and Eve from Paradise for disobedience. He is also a merciless destroyer who sends fire and brimstone on Sodom and Gomorrah and deluges the earth under Noah. He tests Job. He visits Abraham as a guest, then he tests him, as well, by demanding his son as a burnt offering.
He shows mercy, he is slow to anger and long suffering. But he is also a jealous God who punishes the offspring for the seventh generation. He is hiding in a burning bush at the time of Moses and in a column of smoke or in a pillar of cloud in the desert leading the people. He is a mighty warrior showing no mercy to the enemy. But he sent his son to die on the cross for our salvation.
He dwells in the holy of holies, but allows the prophet Isaiah to visit his chamber. His chamber is in the heavenly Jerusalem where Jesus is sitting at his right hand.
Diana, this is the God who created us for his own image to be just as colorful as he is.
Huh Colorful? Us Christians (CATHOLIC) do not worry about colorful... we are worried about inheriting internal life, Matt:6:19-23 built your treasure in heaven rather built your treasure on earth. For a faster process to heaven pray for Martyrdom, die for his name to inherent Heaven. Announce the gospel rather sit in a corner to keep the good news for yourself.
DeleteIn Guam is easy to pass an invitation but try that were I'm from. People would snarl and spit at you. Europe is supposedly a Christian country, where I'm from culture are more blunt and straight forward.
Luis L. Carino =====> Espana
unabrazo Hermanos
What is your internal life that you have to inherit, Luis? I am all ears.
DeleteDear Femina,
DeleteHe meant "eternal life."
is there a way I can get Pat Cottman to speak at one of our retreats?
ReplyDeleteemail or address?
LOL@12:03 AM. I smell CCOG troll.
Deleteto 8:46
DeleteI am not ccog
then what are you Anonymous February 20, 2018 at 11:54 PM??
Deleteretreats?.....what retreats???
DeleteAnonymousFebruary 20, 2018 at 11:54 PM
to 8:46
I am not ccog
And it is not fair to say you are but how can we truly acknowledge what we are in front of the CROSS.
What good will the message that Pat will proclaim if we are not at the foot of the CROSS.
less we forget; even the apostles were not at the foot of the CROSS.
don't really care if you are ccog....not important.
Are you ready to listen to a catehist? Anonymous February 20, 2018 at 11:54 PM
Dear J. Bautista,
DeleteWhich church do you attend for Mass? Does it allow for the Celebration of the Eucharist as the Way does it?
I go to an event where Christ comes to me in all phases of the celebration...starting with the kiss of peace of brothers and sisters who come to acknowledge that only through his grace we are present to receive his mercy.
DeleteI do not deserve to be there as I am the most unworthy sinner to be in his presence.
Love your brother as you love yourself?.....Sorry.....can't do that....not this morning....not tonight. Nonetheless Christ still comes.
With all my faults...weakness....sins...he still comes.
Just reflect, prepare and be ready ....all these struggles even before the start of the Mass.
Do you still want to come to a NCW Celebration of the EUCHARIST?
Hi J. Bautista, I guess it is beautiful that you start your mass celebration with the kiss of peace of brothers and sisters. What else can show the grace of the Father we are present to receive better than a kiss or two on the cheek of the brothers? In my church we only shake hands or the relatives kiss each other. That is it. I wonder if we are doing enough to show the love of the Father in each of us.
DeleteIs it not interesting that the enemies of the Way always give themselves out? They make one or two comments and just cannot hide their malice and hatred. Perhaps they are just jealous of the fruits of the Way? When they come to smear us and insinuate unfounded accusations we recognize them immediately as the enemies of Christ! If is just funny that they act as if surprised and complain hen we tell them. Why, what did they truly expect?! Did they expect kisses on their face?
DeleteEnemies receive the enemies' treatment which is love. They just have to bend down and find out the love behind corrections. Without humility, they will never find out our love for them. So they just continue going blind, deaf and senseless, making themselves enemies for people, church and God. How sad!
In preparation to be in communion with Christ, before the beginning of the Mass or receiving the Eucharist; I approach a brother or sister who I feel has transgressed; talked about me or otherwise has done something to make me mad.
DeleteRegardless of the situation; I ask for forgiveness. Regardless of who is right or wrong; I ask for forgiveness.
The kiss of peace than becomes real; black and white reality that communion in Christ is lived in that I am able forgive and the brother has the Spirit to forgive me.
The communion with family and friends before the Mass is fine; but the communion with enemies...strangers separate...defines the hypocrite.
and when the brother or sister forgives me...may the Spirit of the Lord be with you always...
Diana mr.san Agustin is answering back and guess what he’s saying he said that he is getting smeared and distrust of his friends and colleagues I wander who is he talking about maybe he’s talking about some group called ccog and lfm
ReplyDeleteHi Diana, Billy Graham died. He was a great preacher. Whatever he did in his long life helped also the Catholic renewal worldwide. What is your take on this?
ReplyDelete