One difference between Catholics and Protestants is that many Protestants separate the Church from Jesus Christ. The Church and Christ are one because Christ is the groom and the Church is the bride. St. Paul said that husbands and wives are one flesh, and he compared this oneness with Christ and the Church. Christ and His Church are also one. He is the head and the Church is his body. Head and body are one. When you separate the head from the body, the body is dead. Husband and wife becomes one flesh. Christ and the Church becomes one spirit.
CCC 796 ..........This is the whole Christ, head and body one formed from many...whether the head or members speak, it is Christ who speaks. He speaks in his role as the head (ex persona capitis) and in his role as body (ex persona corporis). What does this mean? "The two will become one flesh. This is a great mystery, and I am applying it to Christ and the Church." And the Lord himself says in the Gospel: "So they are no longer two, but one flesh." They are, in fact, two different persons, yet they are one in conjugal union....as head, he calls himself the bridegroom, as body, he calls himself "bride."
Many Protestants go "church shopping" because they separate the church from Christ. They seek the ideal church for themselves....a church that suits them better. And they have a variety to choose from. Catholics, on the other hand, follow the doctrines of the Catholic Church which clearly spells out that you cannot separate the Church and Christ.
CCC 795 Christ and his Church thus together make up the "whole Christ" (Christus totus). The Church is one with Christ. The saints are acutely aware of this unity.
Let us rejoice then and give thanks that we have become not only Christians, but Christ himself. Do you understand and grasp, brethren. God's grace toward us? Marvel and rejoice: we have become Christ for if he is the head, we are the members, he and we together are the whole man....the fullness of Christ then is the head and the members. But what does "head and members" mean? Christ and the Church.
Our redeemer has shown himself to be one person with the holy Church whom he has taken to himself Head and members form as it were one and the same mystical person.
A reply of St. Joan of Arc to her judges sums up the faith of the holy doctors and good sense of the believer, "About Jesus Christ and the Church. I simply know they're just one thing and we shouldn't complicate the matter."
How wonderful and amazing that the Catechism of the Catholic Church describes the "Church" as its members, which include the leaders of the Church (bishops and priests). A Catholic's faith is in Jesus Christ AND the Church for they are inseparable. Protestants, on the other hand, usually say that their faith should only be in Jesus Christ. This is one of the things that differentiates us from our Protestant brothers.
I think the reason why they separate Christ and the church is so they could easily rebel against the church and still tell themselves that they're doing God's will. They go from one church to another, looking for a church that follows their will.
ReplyDeleteDear Jane Doe,
DeleteI agree. The Church is not separate from Christ. A few times in my blog, I have stated that any persecution on Christians is a persecution on Christ.
Diana, unity means that division should be avoided. That is why you cannot claim persecution from inside your own church. How do you imagine that the Body of Christ would persecute the Body of Christ?
DeleteDear Grow up,
DeleteUnity means you do not discriminate and persecute your brother. The moment you become the persecutors, you put yourself outside the Church. Persecution of others is a sin and sin separates one from God and His Church.
Christ said they will persecute you just as they persecuted him. Christ NEVER said to persecute others including your brother.
Diana, that is why the church's hierarchy is a Holy Order, so that no laity can override its authority. Call them catechists or by other names, laity cannot take over the church.
ReplyDeleteDear Grow up,
DeletePlease stick to the topic of discussion. The topic of discussion is about the unity of Christ and his Church as one. Please re-read the post again.
Protestant believe in divorce... when the tough gets going... divorce... protest...
ReplyDeleteCatholics believe in forgiveness, carrying the sins of those who persecute us...
Let those who persecute us enjoy their divorce... we will suffer through persecution showing by our suffering that we love.
I pray the families of our persecutors do not pay the price of their sins.
Dear Anonymous at 10:15 am,
DeleteI agree that divorce is another difference between Catholics and Protestants. Protestants have the highest divorce rate. See the weblink below:
http://maselliwarren.com/2014/05/29/religions-most-likely-to-get-divorced/
I also agree that Protestants are the ones who protest. In fact, that is the reason they have the name "Protestants." They protested against the Catholic Church. And they're still protesting. If they don't like that pastor, they go to another pastor. If they like the pastor, they won't protest, and they will stay in the church.
Diana, your post suggests that there cannot be different ideas and interests in a family. But how about prearranged marriages? The literature of romanticism found a theme in the natural resistance or rebellion of kids toward prearrangement in their romantic lives. The Chamorro story of the Two Lovers is a great example, similar to that story of Romeo and Juliet in Schakespeare's drama.
ReplyDeleteOur faith tells us that kids deserve freedom in their choices, especially if they otherwise lead an exemplary Catholic lifestyle. But what if a daughter comes into conflict with her father who has already spotted a future bridegroom for her? If this cause a division in their family, who is to resolve the problem? In the church, we trust our resolutions on Jesus. But should a girl give up her love interest in order to be obedient to her father?
Dear Femina,
DeleteIn our family, my husband and I set down the rules of the household and our children are expected to obey those rules.
This is 21st century Guam. We no longer practice arranged marriages, so you do not need to worry about that. As parents, it is our responsibility to lay down the ground rules in our household and teach our children right from wrong. When they are old enough, they can make their own choices.
Dear femina your talking about two lovers point two lovers point is not about love it’s about suicide so your making it about suicide now they are not romantic
DeleteI respectfully disagree. The suicide of the Two Lovers was forced on them by an unwavering father who wanted to dictate the romantic interest of his daughter and chased the young couple into the edge of the rock.
DeleteDear Femina,
DeleteThe story of Two Lovers Point is found in the weblink below:
http://www.guampedia.com/puntan-dos-amantes-folktale/
It never had anything to do with the dictatorship of the father. It had to do the caste system.
A father may feel entitled to dictate her daughter what to do for one reason or the other. In thge tragedy of the Two Lovers, the role of the caste system is accidental. In Shakespeare's tragedy it was not the caste system, it was the animosity between family clans.
DeleteThe point is that the outcome is always the same: the father mercilessly crushes the young life because he feels entitled to do so. But God has never given him such kind of authority!
That is why parental authority in modern families is eroding. It has been too long that heartless family heads imposed their will on others without appeal and control. Some men cannot handle their own authority and became monsters who torture their family members, including his wife and the kids.
Diana, your rule was a product of the patriarchal times. Men are still conspiring with each other today to control their wives according to their compulsion for dominance and capricious will.
Dear Femina,
DeleteThose were different times. In a matrilineal society such as Guam, it was the mother who decided who the children should marry. So, how was that any better when the woman took control?
The key is for the mother to raise her sons to respect and protect women and for the father to protect his daughters, showing her the kind of man she should look for.
Diana, this is not right. Parents have no business in telling whom their daughter should have as her company. There are times when a wife tells her husband to back off, and there are times then a child tells her parents to back off. A daughter living in her parents' house still should be able to make her own decisions without undue interference. The church does not teach subjugation to personal authority.
DeleteDear Femina,
DeleteA parent has every right to tell their child what to do because they are minors and responsible for them. When they become adults, they can move out of the house and be on their own. Do you have any children?
Diana, you have a right to tell your child what to do as long as the safety of the child is concerned. That is what you as parent are responsible for. But otherwise?
DeleteHow do you want to tell a child in Kindergarten whom to be with friends? True friendship cannot be dictated. Not in Kindergarten, not later in life. You have nourish her little femina spirit so that she can make her own steps when she grows up. The same way, true love cannot be dictated. Your understanding of freedom of children in Catholic families looks one sided to me.
Dear Femina,
DeleteRaise your children the way you want, but do not tell me how to raise my kids.
http://cathnews.com/archives/cath-news-archive/31545-boom-time-for-seminaries
ReplyDelete"The Protestant Reformation was a major 16th century European movement aimed initially at reforming the beliefs and practices of the Roman Catholic Church. Its religious aspects were supplemented by ambitious political rulers who wanted to extend their power and control at the expense of the Church. The Reformation ended the unity imposed by medieval Christianity and, in the eyes of many historians, signaled the beginning of the modern era. (theopedia)
ReplyDeleteIt had all to do with RC abuses and the desire to impose control and power on the the people and not about faith, belief system.
God is Still speaking
Protestantism was a rebellion against church hierarchy at a time when the Catholic Church had a lot of corruption inside its ranks. protestants organized an alternative church hierarchy from their own ranks to compete with that of the Holy Order. This led to a breaking of unity and splitting from the Catholic Church.
DeleteProtestants claimed that the Synods of the Catholic Church did not follow the spirit of God and thus became retrograde to salvation.
They also broke with sacred tradition and invented the Sola Scriptura. They worship the Bible as the source of all truth as if it would be the Holy Tabernacle. But the same time replaced the Holy Eucharist into commemoration rather than consubstantiation.
Despite all these doing, Protestantism is not a sin. Protestants can go to heaven! It is just an alternative path to the grace of God, apart from the Catholic Church. Protestants preach Jesus Christ to the world efficiently. Mainland America is mostly Protestant.
Dear Grow Up in Faith,
DeleteWhat protestants believe is ridiculous from a Christian point of view. Christ never rebelled or broke away from his own people. IF anything his people broke away from him, historically speaking. Christ's answer to corruption was to eventually give his own life for his people and carry the sins of his people and humanity.
This is why protestants have a huge error, and although they do a lot of good and the world and help to bring people closer to Christ they still lack the foundation to reach adult Christian life. This can be seen in the fact that most have a special hatred for the Catholic Church. This hatred is not reciprocal as the Catholic Church does not view protestant faiths with contempt but rather sees the good that they are doing. In the end there is only one Christ.
However the biggest difference as Diana pointed out is the fact that they cut with Peter the rock. This is why there are so many protestant Christian denominations. They loose the tradition passed down by the apostles and allow for any interpretation of scripture when there is only one interpretation.
Jesus did a lot of interpretation and moving away from how the Hebrew scriptures was interpreted. So what is wrong with leaving the traditional way of interpreting scripture. Jesus did.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 3:51 am,
DeleteCan you give the biblical verse showing that he did this?
How jESUS interpreted the 10 commandments. How he gave a new dimension to the Sabbath.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 12:39 pm,
DeleteThose are not interpretations. Those are fulfillment. Jesus did not do away with any of the laws or what the prophets said. He came to fulfill them.
Dear Anonymous, I have good friends who happen to be Protestants. Thus, I do not appreciate an attitude against them. They are NOT in huge error, they just worship God in a different assembly. Their love for Jesus is unquestionable. They do NOT hate Catholics, it is more like a condescending sympathy, even pity, watching our Church to cope with its internal turmoil. They don't have anything similar.
DeleteChristian denominations abound in mainland America. This indicates a great strength as a Christian nation under the sun! Denying this would be perceived anti-American sentiment. We need to respect other denominations, even if we Catholics are the biggest, and acknowledge their way to salvation. They do a lot for spreading and protecting Christianity around the globe!
That said, we should look at the roots of division among Christian denominations. We see internal corruption that is also richly experienced on Guam. There is an adamant spirit of rebellion that made dissenters to establish an alternative church hierarchy, first inside the Catholic Church and then apart from it. They used their leverage against the Seven Holy Sacraments. They turned against the Holy Order of consecrated Catholic priests and bishops, to blackmail them into accepting their dissenting views. Only after this acceptance was refused, did they turn away and established their own churches.
A Protestant priest is not consecrated to Christ. Still, they get out to evangelize the uninformed claiming they evangelize to Jesus Christ. In fact, they evangelize to their dissent, giving the believers their own distorted doctrines of Christianity with a corrupted image of Jesus.
Seeing these deep roots of division, we must unify our church even more. Any church group that is not following local authorities and turn against their own bishop ought to be warned even disciplined on time before they cause a schism. Division is creeping into the foundations of the church in the form of false interpretations of Holy Scripture, superstition, corruption of the Sacraments and the image of Jesus. These are sure signs that Vatican and the Pope must act with authority to save the flock!
The five strikes:
Delete1. “You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment."
2. “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart."
3. “It has been said, ‘Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce.’ But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, makes her the victim of adultery, and anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery."
4. “Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not break your oath, but fulfill to the Lord the vows you have made.’ But I tell you, do not swear an oath at all: either by heaven, for it is God’s throne; or by the earth, for it is his footstool; or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the Great King."
5. “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also."
(Matt 5)
Diana, where do you see fulfillment in these 5 strikes? Jesus is overriding here everything people knew about God!
Dear Grow up in faith, are you serious? We are Catholics. We are not against Protestants, but disagree with them on a grand scale! Protestants broke away from the true teaching about Christ. Christ was human and divine, both! Just like the believer who has the divine spark in his or her life.
DeleteWe have the blood of Christ circulating in our veins! We take the Eucharist under both species, bread and wine. Both! How can you "worship God in a different assembly" without consuming the Holy Eucharist as the transubstantiated Body of Christ? This is a grave omission from the faithful.
How do you think Christ can be separated from the Body of Christ which is His Church? Protestants separated themselves from the church hierarchy which is only in the Catholic church and not in the Protestant church. Protestants are very wrong on this!
Protestants are not Christians because how can you be adult in faith without participating in the Holy Eucharist? Have you even seen a Protestant who would lay down his life for his enemy? Nope! There is such thing among them! How could be? It is only the Christian adult faith who can do that. That makes the whole difference! That is why we are Christian. Are you?
Dear Anonymous at 5:08 pm,
DeleteI believe what Christ said because he is Truth and he speaks the truth. I do not believe YOUR interpretation. Perhaps, you misinterpreted what "fulfill" means.
Matthew 5:17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.
Please do not overdo this dear Anonymous! Do you have the blood of Christ circulating in your veins? Really? What you eat or drink goes to your stomach for digestion. This is human biology.
DeleteProtestants do have their own churches! Why would they need the Catholic church? Why would they follow the Catholic hierarchy when they have their own? If you ask them they'll tell you all churches are the Body of Christ, because all churches are part of the Universal Church of Jesus Christ. All churches are part of the Kingdom of Jesus. They follow their own church, not ours.
Protestants are Christians, just like we Catholics, they are our brothers in Christ even if we disagree on things. Christian is who has faith in Jesus and the Creed. We are followers of Jesus who died on the cross for our sins. Jesus died for both Catholics and Protestant. It is not necessary to convert to be saved. It is our hope that we'll be together with our Protestant brothers in heaven.
If you want to lay down your life for your enemy, then please do so and I'll admire you for that. How do you do it? Are you going to the war zone? It is not a requirement for either faith or salvation to get killed. Many saints of the Catholic Church lived a long life without sacrificing their life for someone you may call an enemy.
Who is your enemy if everybody is your neighbor?
Dear Grow up,
DeleteSee my response in the following weblink:
https://neocatechemunal.blogspot.com/2018/03/my-response-to-grow-up.html
Dear anon at 3:51am
DeleteChrist did not move away from Jewish teachings he actually moved towards them. Many scholars say he was very close to the Essenes who where an order of extremely strict Jewish monks during his time.
He was actually calling the Jewish faith to go back to its roots as he saw that many of the pharisees had become corrupt and lost traditions using the law for personal gain. It is a very similar situation to that of the NCW actually. Christ never split from Jewish tradition, he observed it closely which is why many scribes and teachers recognized him in secret because they where afraid of the current powers. Example: Nicodemus
Dear God is still speaking,
ReplyDeleteThe similarity between St. Francis of Assisi and Martin Luther is that during their time, the Church was filled with corrupted leaders. The difference between them is that St. Francis of Assisi stayed to help bring about reforms needed in the Church while Martin Luther rebelled against the Church.
Dear Grow up,
Today, being a Protestant is not a sin because many grew up, knowing only the Protestant doctrine. It was only a sin at the time of its birth with Martin Luther because they were Catholics who chose to oppose the Church.
Let us also not lose sight of the main topic in the OP. Protestants separate Christ and the Church. It is the Protestants who say that one should have faith in Christ, not the Church and church leaders. Catholics, on the other hand believe that the Church along with her leaders are inseparable from Christ. They are one.
And yes, the NCW is part of the Catholic Church. Therefore, all the persecution made against us is a persecution on Christ.
Dear anon 5:08pm
DeleteIF you want to properly interpret what fulfill the law means first you have to see what Christ's interpretation of the law is. When the elder asks Christ what is the law and the prophets he responds with a summary of the ten commandments, you shall love God above all things with all your heart, strength and mind (soul), and your neighbor as yourself.
Christ indeed fulfills this on the cross since he loves God so much he allows his mind(soul) to be crowned with thorns and does not reason what is happening, his heart is pierced with a spear and his strength (hands feet) are nailed to the cross. By this he is loving God completely entering into his will which is death. Fulfilling this love for God he automatically fulfill love for neighbor since it is the will of God, and by entering into death he loves all those who are his enemies, not judging them but justifying all those who seek mercy in front of the father. God saw this complete obedience to him and exalted it and raised him up from the dead. This is why all the letters say that God the father raised Christ from the dead. He redeemed us and gave us the possibility of eternal life if we desire it.
This is what is meant by Christ fulfilling the law.
--IntelTheist