There are already 100 comments in my post "Internal Report of Cathedral Bascilica and Catholic Cemeteries," and it appears that people still want to discuss this topic. There has also been a few divergent comments under that thread, so please folks do not diverge from the main OP as much as possible.
I only included part of the report, which stated the following:
Between January 2009 and July 2014, Msgr. Benavente received payments of $326,913.61 by simultaneously drawing payroll and stipends from the Catholic Cemeteries, and stipend payments from the Cathedral-Basilica. Upon the change of administration, credit cards in the name of the Archdiocese were discovered holding balances in excess of $60,000; the credit card in the name of The Catholic Cemeteries was specifically used by Msgr. Benavente for restaurants, air fare, the Shangi-La Hotel in Manila and other five star Hotels. In the same period, The Catholic Cemeteries and the Cathedral-Basilica expended more than $123,000 towards credit card payments to First Hawaiian Bank and American Express. Other payments for a credit card in the name of Msgr. Benavente, a gas card, and cellular/data phone privileges, which were paid for by The Catholic Cemeteries, accounted for an additional $23,000. Notably, $13,000 of cemetery funds were paid for Msgr. Benavente's 20th Anniversary reception. Total advances documented between January 2009 and July 2014 by both entities for Msgr. Benavente are nearly $475,000. This does not include cemetery family crypts valued at 380,000.00, which were gifted by Msgr. Benavente to his close friend and family: in other words, no fee was charged for these cemetery plots.
The rest of the Internal Report can be found in the Archdiocese of Agana website:
http://www.aganaarch.org/8188/archdiocesan-internal-review-report-cathedral-basilica-catholic-cemeteries-2/
It was Monsignor James who first brought the scandal of financial mismanagement to the media. The first time the public heard of the financial mismanagement of Monsignor James did not come from the Archbishop. It came through Tim Rohr's blog, which is a social media. It was on July 26, 2014 when Tim first posted about hearing the removal of Monsignor Benavente.
It was in the morning of July 26th when a letter from the Archbishop was delivered to Monsignor James. This letter did not go to the Media. It only went to Monsignor James. Monsignor James then wrote a letter to the employees of the Catholic Cemeteries, the Catholic Gift Shop, and the Catholic-Bascillica informing them of his removal. That letter (which stated "Confidential") was given to Tim Rohr and published on his blog. It was through Junglewatch that the public learned about the reason for Monsignor's removal.
At 9:17 pm, KUAM picked up the story because someone sent KUAM the same letter. It was also through Junglewatch that the public learned the reason for Monsignor Benavente's removal. Tim Rohr published the following information of Monsignor James Benavente on Saturday, July 26, 2014.
http://www.junglewatch.info/2014/07/msgr-james-benavente-removed-as-rector.html
This was where it all started. The Umatuna did not mention any financial mismanagement. It only mentioned that Monsignor James was transferred and that Monsignor David would take over his position. Now, CCOG wants to know why the Archdiocese released the Internal Report regarding Monsignor James and not privately speak to Monsignor James about it. I think they should start from the beginning and ask why did Monsignor James went to the media first to reveal the scandal regarding himself.
Based on the Internal Report and D&T report, it is pretty clear that the reason Monsignor James was removed was due to financial mismanagement and not for some other ulterior motives made up by the jungle. Furthermore, I do not see Richard Untalan and the rest of the finance council of Benavente having another prayer protest at the steps of the Cathedral refuting the numbers on the Internal Report.
ReplyDeleteLet's be honest. Why would anyone waste their time protesting about a fake internal report? It's all a sham to have people feel sorry so they can start donating again. Nice try.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 10:46 pm,
DeleteI do not hear the former finance council of Monsignor Benavente say anything. Of all people, they were the ones who should know about these things. Why did they kept this out from the public? Why did they not let the public know about the free cemetery plots and the rest of the other things mentioned in the report? But most importantly, why did Monsignor James go to the media to report the scandal on himself? It was never the Archbishop who went to the media first.
One thing in the report that stood out for me was the "free cemetery plots". The other blog justified it by saying that these "free plots" were a compensation for services rendered. I am bothered by this because these are Catholic Cemetery Plots, not Hagatna Parishioner plots, 100k donor plots and so on. These are plots in a cemetery where all those being buried are CATHOLIC. Shouldnt we all be compensated with "free plots" for all the years of service that we have put forth for our Catholic Church? This doesn't sound fair at all.
DeleteWhat about all the cellphones for all the altar boys? Top of the line. For years, many were talking about the perks of ministering at the Cathedral Basilica. I even contemplated transferring there just to avail myself of all the premiums. I wonder if the same promos are being offered at Saint Anthonys?
There are a few other credit cards that need to be reviewed by the Concerned individuals.
Yes, I agree. This need for a review/audit looks like a job for CONCERNED CATHOLICS OF GUAM! !!!!!!!
DeleteWhat does it mean to be catechized?
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 5:44 pm,
DeleteAccording to Dictionary.com, "to instruct orally by means of questions and answers, especially in Christian doctrine."
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/catechize%20?s=t
Diana - of course anyone could have gone to the dictionary to look up the meaning. What does it really mean in the neo way?
DeleteWhy would one need to be catechized before attending a catechesis?
DeleteDear Anonymous at 8:50 pm,
DeleteExactly what it means in the Dictionary. Why else did you think I gave you the dictionary?
Dear Anonymous at 9:36 pm,
DeleteAccording to the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
CCC 7 "Catechesis is intimately bound up with the whole of the Church's life. Not only her geographical extension and numerical increase, but even more her inner growth and correspondence with God's plan depend essentially on catechesis."10
CCC 2688 The catechesis of children, young people, and adults aims at teaching them to meditate on The Word of God in personal prayer, practicing it in liturgical prayer, and internalizing it at all times in order to bear fruit in a new life. Catechesis is also a time for the discernment and education of popular piety. The memorization of basic prayers offers an essential support to the life of prayer, but it is important to help learners savor their meaning.
What about Joe Rivera and Art Ilagan? Didn't they say that benavente was an excellent administrator. Didn't Joe Rivera and Art Ilagan (renowned finance people) say that the cathedral and cemetery were in good financial shape? Why all the lies? Why were they willing to risk their good and not so good names to protect and defend a corrupt priest? I think its a crying shame what benavente did. What i find unique about this whole drama is that there are some people blaming the bishop for smearing the name of benavente. Excuse me?
ReplyDeleteWhat? No prayer vigils? No prayer marches. Should we go to the cathedral steps and have a prayer service? Should we write to Krebs, Filoni? Should we write to Tagle? How about Savio Hon?
BIG QUESTION: Where is the CCOG now that we have a transparent record here of abuses.
Let's look at the goals of CCOG's. They are:
1. "Work to achieve financial transparency in the archdiocese_ - Hey CCOG, look what we found at the cemetery!
2. "Assist the archdiocese put their finances in order" - Hey, can CCOG check where benavente spent the thousands of dollars in trips and hotels? How we gonna get it back?
3. "Recommend amendments to archdiocesan policies which do not justly address serious concerns, especially with the current sex abuse policy" - Sure, let's do this!
4. "To represent the concerns of the laity in regards to any archdiocesan decision to alienate real property, especially property which was given to the church for a specific purpose" - Fine, as long as you don't sell church property to cover benavente's debts.
5. "To engage in activities that promotes the Catholic Faith in Guam in accordance with sacred traditions, Scripture and the Magisterium of The Roman Catholic Church" - Sure, there are several catechesis taking place in the some parishes; the Neos love the scripture and encourage large traditional families. That's right up the magisterial line-up.
6. "To encourage the observance of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, as approved by the Sacred Congregation of Rites" - Sure, no problem. Sounds like a good deal. Let's do this!
7. "Evaluate the performance of the management of the archdiocese and recommend changes where necessary" - Ok, we got lots of money that's been stolen from the Cathedral and cemetery; can you recommend how we can get it back? We are 'concerned' that the management performance of benavente has been really shady and we need to figure out how to fix this.
Now, do you think the folks like R. Untalan (disbarred atty.), Gil and Tommy (ex-cons) can help us through this nightmare? What kind of experience do they have with HANDLING MONEY? Do you think we can trust them? Let's ask Ilagan and Joe Rivera, they seem to know a lot about 'good administrators'.
Hello? CCOG, are your there? Press conference, anyone? (Crickets are roaring).
R. Untalan is the last person who should be involved with financial mismanagement with Benavente.
DeleteSee link:
http://law.justia.com/cases/district-of-columbia/court-of-appeals/1993/90-sp-91-5.html
"Furthermore, I do not see Richard Untalan and the rest of the finance council of Benavente having another prayer protest at the steps of the Cathedral refuting the numbers on the Internal Report"..
ReplyDeletearen't you contemptuous. as they say, it is always quiet before a storm. so much for reconciliation ay?
Dear Anonymous at 7:11 pm,
DeleteLet us be honest here. Tim Rohr admitted that in his meeting with Archbishops Krebs and Hon, he was told to help out. Since they left, has he helped out? No. Even after they left he continued his rampage against the Way and the Archbishop. How is that helping out?
Remember Diana that TIM ROHR AND BENAVENTE are FRIENDS (PDN said so). So, no matter how much corruption has been exposed, no matter how much truth has been proven in the review, no matter how much benavente stole from the church, in the eyes of ROHR, benavente is next to GOD. He can do no wrong. If ROHR were pope, benavente will be a walking saint. This is ROHR'S way of 'helping out' the situation.
DeletePEOPLE PLEASE UNDERSTAND!
ReplyDeleteThe Archbishop DID NOT start this whole public fiasco! TIM ROHR did!
It was him who made this public!
Monsignor brought this to the public!
How can you guys not know that? It was on the media.
The Archbishop is the boss of Monsignor. What he did was within his authority.
The question remains...
WHAT WAS MONSIGNOR'S INTENTION FOR BRINGING THIS TO THE PUBLIC?
HE IS STILL A PRIEST ISN'T HE?
Ai adai 10:09 PM. Yell all you want. It doesn't matter who started what. What matters is we have a church torn like it's never been on Guam. We need to bring the church back to where it was and return the NCW to wherever it came from.
DeleteAnon 10:57: So, to bring the church to unity we need to kick out the Neocatechumenal Way? Really consistent logic here! You amazing.
DeleteYes 11:07, that's absolutely right. The NCW needs to go and be on their own and the rest of us will not bother you any more. Please no more hanging on to the tails of our Catholic Church just so you can scam us. Enough is enough!!
DeleteAnon 11:32, did u say scam? You mean like what your dear patron Benavente did with church money buying for himself friends and supporters? That kind of scam?
DeleteThe Bishop should have never become a "brother". He should have remained our Shepard. As we know now the Bishop answers to his responsibles and his catechists.
DeleteHe's supposed to be the supreme catechist of the Diocese. but nope. he's follows a priest from Malta and two other single people.
Is this the plan of the Vatican?
Dear Anonymous at 7:56 am,
DeleteThe Archbishop was a shepherd. He never made the scandal of Monsignor Benavente public. Monsignor Benavente was the one who went to the public about the scandal.
My I repeat he NEVER should have joined the way as a walker. Period.
DeleteAnonymous 10:57,
DeleteHow many times do we have to tell you that ARCHBISHOP did NOT go to the public with this.
It's obvious that this fact doesn't matter to you. Therefore you people have an ulterior motive...(not surprising).
Diana, the archdiocese owes Tim a significant amount of money and Tim intends to collect. They can start dong the right thing by paying Tim. What other money do the archdiocese owe?
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous at 10:58 pm,
DeleteI think it is time for the Archdiocese to look into those free cemetery plots. Does Tim Rohr have any free cemetery plot? IF he does, then they can start collecting from him.
Anon 10:58 Shouldn't it be the other way around? The Archdiocese should ask how can the church's money be recovered from thieves?
DeleteIf benavente ran off with hundreds of thousands of dollars of church money, how can the church recover it? Ay ya yai!
The things that they accuse the Archbishop are things they are guilty of themselves. The Archbishop has said that it was the AFC that wanted to sell the Seminary to pay of the debts of the Catholic Cemeteries and Catholic Bascilica They thought the Archbishop was going to give the seminary away for nothing. They prefer that he get some money for it so they could pay off the debts. When they discovered about the perpetual use, they are still angry because as Tim Rohr pointed out the seminary is valueless. They can't sell it or use it for collateral. If they had gone through their plans, Tim Rohr would most likely benefit it from it handsomely, considering that he is a realtor and friend of Monsignor Benavente.
DeleteI am pasting a link about the Pope's homily today. I suggest you post it on the blog not because necessarily the ncw and your community is such an 'ecclesial elite group' (actually i hope and pray it isn't) but to show people that your thoughts agree with what the pope says about guarding in a community such as the ncw communities. Here is the link :) http://www.news.va/en/news/pope-no-to-ecclesial-elites-who-privatize-the-fait
ReplyDelete"The Pope pointed out that the author of the Letter to the Hebrews gave some very important practical advice: ‘Do not absent yourself from your own assemblies, as some do.’ He said this happens when we’re at such assemblies, in the parish or community and we judge the others, when there’s this kind of scorn towards the others. This, Pope Francis stressed, is not the new and living way of Jesus."
DeleteHi Keith. Thanks for the link. This paragraph gave me a lot to ponder about. I am in the Way but my mother is not and none of by brothers. They have already told me I became highbrow but I think it is not so. I do not have scorn towards my family because they are pious and faithful to God. But I do have scorn towards some of my parish members, who just come to church on Sundays, pick up the bulletin after mass and go. That's all they do, they keep their faith private. I reckon we offer them alternative to become more involved Christians and break out of their private cages in the Way. As the Pope said faith and salvation cannot be private.
all we need to ask ourselves is why?.......why the attacks on the Arch Bishop? Tactic to date is to discredit....smear AAA....divide and conquer
ReplyDelete1. with AAA out of the way; who would benefit......who will be the next Arch Bishop?
2. how would they benefit?
I was just also thinking about some parishioners who are adamant about not having the Way in their church.
If we have priest who are in communion.....faithful to their oath....why don't they tell the same parishioners that it is God's church...not theirs.
I believe there are other motivations....hidden motivations.
Dear Anonymous at 12:53 am,
DeletePerhaps, we should go back to the beginning with Father Paul, when Tim Rohr starting to criticize the Archbishop publicly? What do you think?
Yes Line by Line. Let's analyse it.
DeleteYes, LET'S BEGIN.
DeleteFIRST LESSON: One word can describe the actions of both gofigan and benavente: DISOBEDIENCE!
That is the one word that should cover all their actions. Why? Because disobedience has many sour fruits.
I think that the financial mismanagement explains the reason why the Archbishop was getting no cooperation when he was trying to get the financial report published and sent to Archbishop Balvo. The other side apparently had something to hide and kept stalling. It explains the truthfulness of Archbishop Apuron when he said that the former finance council (whom he fired) expressed a desire to sell the seminary to pay off the debts at the Catholic Cemeteries and Catholic Bascilica.
ReplyDeleteStarting with Gofigan disobedience + Patty Arroyo + started throwing in the Neocatechumenal Way + Tim Rohr Malign Accusation, equals too "Escape Goat"+ Concerned think they are CATHOLIC + Transparency demanded (RMS, NCW Contribution etc) + Financial Mismanagement + Msgnr James Benavente = Audit by Delloite & Touche = Results and manifestation of failure to pay debts, credit card misuse,300KPlus worth free plots family,friends (Suspecting Tim Rohr included) etc.
DeleteTim Rohr that Cathedral owe him 2K, please folks keep in mind he supposedly a servant of the Church but he charges the Church with PEOPLE's money. So there fore give it to him, whatever makes him happy. How bout his business rental, Vehicle (Is that the Church or his personal), fuel and utilities. Is this free of charge? No , charge to parishioner of Agana. So my money! paid his paycheck. Did the Jungle bother to look into this? No!
Diana, it only makes sense. They had something big to hide. It was finally revealed. The review had exposed all the corruption going on. That the was reason why selling the seminary was necessary. The only way to cover their corruption was to feel the seminary, cover the debts and then benavente comes out looking clean. He'll come out all cleaned up and spiffy just in time for Tagle to consecrate him the next archbishop of guam.
DeleteThis explains why rohr, untalan, rivera, the holy knights and even former gov gutierrez were all excited to see benavente mount the throne at the cathedral. Greg Perez, Untalan, E. Terlage, Joe San Agustin, G. Taitano (all knights of st. sylvester) were working hard to defend benavente because they too probably received some sort of payment for their support.
All these fine catholic men in support of the corruption! It is really hard to believe. And they were all willing to stand at the steps of the cathedral to pray in defense of corruption?
Diana, this report to Nuncio Balvo goes way back..if not mistaken, the late Judge CRISTOBAL Duenas was on the finance council. Do you think that a man of his integrity, one who is so close to the church would allow things to be hidden. I don't think so! The man played by the book.
DeleteAnon 3:32 - And do you think that Msgr James who was close to the money would allow himself to take money for his own personal use in the hundreds of thousands? Apparently if the good Monsignor was true to his conscience, would all this have happened? The facts reveal that Mons James played by a particular book. Which book? Good question. Time will tell. History will tell. This is a dark day for the history of the Cathedral and even darker for the cemeteries.
DeleteAnonymous @7:56 AM hit it on the nose. By walking, Archbishop Apuron has taken sides and is therefore in-effective in mediating a problem between members of his flock: those walking and those not. It appears that the non-walkers don't trust the decisions made by the Archbishop due to his having to answer to others above him in the Neo organization. They also use his being Neo as a reason for his actions. (And please don't say they HAVE to obey the Archbishop, because they will say why should they obey him when the Archbishop himself disobeys the Pope's instructions.) You see? tit for tat! And it is getting ugly! So many interpretations of documents--on both sides--that are being misconstrued as facts. It's crazy!!
ReplyDeleteSo how can our church heal?? Who will be an acceptable mediator?? I pray the Lord send a level-headed person to help Guam's Catholics.
Dear Anonymous at 11:27 am,
DeleteRegardless of whether the NCW existed on Guam or not, the Archbishop would still have to remove Monsignor James for financial mismanagement; therefore, the NCW has nothing to do with what he did.
This is an old argument that has seen it's day "Blame the archbishop". So, if the plumbing in the parish doesn't work, do we blame the WAY or the archbishop? These lame excusers are just that, 'lame'.
DeleteThey are afraid to confront the truth about the review and see for themselves that really happened and how hundreds of thousands of dollars of the Lord's money was funneled to pay for private trips, meals, hotels, and really expensive parties with the papal knights, parties in Manila and other unknown personages. If only those Manila taxi drivers can talk!
Anon 11:27. This is about Benavente.
DeleteThe NCW has nothing to do with his removal. You give us too much credit if you think we tell the bishop what to do.
I challenge you to go to a catechesis with an open heart and an open mind. See for yourself. I mean that with great sincerity.
If you refuse due to the situation at hand with the Church, then I guess it is inevitable that we will be in disagreement with everything.
Back to square one.
6:17,
DeleteThat is not the issue. The issue is that you are forcing your practices on those who choose traditional catholic traditions. Do you not see what has been happening on this island with the leadership of AAA. He is only for the minority, the NCW. He neglects and treats the others as they are not deserving sheep. There are many innocent ones like you, like my mother, but it doesn't make it right to turn a blind eye. Are you loyal to the NCW/Kiko, or are you loyal to God? Because you can continue you passion for God even if the NCW was discontinued tomorrow.
DeleteAnonymousJanuary 31, 2015 at 7:37 AM
you are following the traditions of a religion......not Jesus Christ.
Clearly you do not know the difference.
JSB
It all started with DISOBEDIENCE!
ReplyDeleteFamous word of Lucifer: 'NON SERVIAM' I WILL NOT SERVE, I WILL NOT OBEY!
DeleteHow often has this been practiced by priests who vowed obedience to the bishop?
DeleteFather Blockley Calls for obedience to the pope today Jumglewatch.
When you don't follow your boss's commands...there are consequences.
ReplyDeleteTHESE PRIESTS DID NOT FOLLOW THE ORDERS OF THEIR BISHOP. That's the bottom line.
THERE ARE CONSEQUENCES.
People disagree with the way the Archbishop executed his decisions? That's your problem.
DISOBEDIENCE! DISOBEDIENCE! DISOBEDIENCE!
Did no one read the Pope's homily that was provided by keith @12:00AM??
ReplyDeleteAccording to Pope Francis "in order not to privatize salvation, I need to ask myself if I speak and communicate the faith, speak and communicate hope, speak, practice and communicate charity. If within a particular community there is no communication between people and no encouragement is given to everybody to practice these three virtues, the members of that community have privatized their faith."
DeleteI do believe the community members go out knocking on doors to speak with people about the love of God and not simply to recruit for the NCW. They also go out between Easter and Pentecost singing songs and announcing the gospel in public places. In line with the Popes recent homily, I do not see how the NCW privatizes the faith.
Yes. And?
DeleteTho must include all the different orders then huh?
Anon 4:10:
DeleteAlso, when we go out two by two knocking on doors, we don't address ourselves from the NCW. We say we are from the parish ( of the village).
One lady said: Really? I thought you were mormans. It's good to know the Catholic Church is finally going out.
We did not say "oh no no they aren't. It's the NCW that is"
That's because you use the Catholic Church as a front. Going door to door doesn't change the fact that you have privatized your practices by limiting access and information. If your honest with yourself, you will admit that as a whole, that NCW members think they are better than non members. You say you are the "chosen ones". Salvation is not just for a select few.
DeleteAsk yourselves this:
Why do my NCW leaders continue to push our preferred practices on other Catholics who follow accepted traditions if the Catholic Church? Why do we consider those outside the NCW as dry bones? Why do we get special treatment over the non Neos? Are these things truly Christ like? Are we defending our belief in God, or are we defending the privileges received through AAA?
Listen to your heart, not just your cathecist. Listen to Jesus in your heart. God did not sacrifice his son for a select few.
Dear Anonymous at 7:27 am,
DeleteDo you not know that the NCW is always saying that they are sinners? So, how are sinners better than the non-NCW?? Do you go out to evangelize as Christ commanded His Church to do? I am sure that you care so much about your parish that you do much more than come to Sunday Mass....right? I am sure you do a lot of volunteer work around your parish in order to help build it up. Also, you say that we get special treatment. Could you explain how does the NCW get special treatment?
How easy you judge me simply because I'm not a NCW MEMBER. Automatically you judge that I do not do those things you say. Evangelizing is not just door to door. It's being a witness to God in your daily walk of life, to everyone you meet. Everyone is a sinner Diana, don't use sinning as a badge of honor. Your comment validates mine.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 11:08 am,
DeleteI did not ask if you evangelize by going door to door, I asked if you evangelize as Christ commanded His Church to do? You appear to take offense at my questions and what I said. Because you took my positive statements as an offense, is it then correct to assume that you only attend Sunday Mass and do not build up your parish through any volunteer work? In the first place, you were the one you judged us for privatizing our practice. So, it is ok for you to judge, but not okay for me to judge???
My personal view is that the problem is that you just speak about the three virtues. You do not practice them a lot. Again speaking from the experience in Malta, maybe there it's different. Speaking alone is not enough, doing work in your parish is important but well, quite a first step in being charitable if you ask me. Being charitable in everything you do, spreading God and Jesus Christ through your everyday actions, at your workplace, being good hearted, kind, generous, not only with the people you love but with those you can't stand or can't stand you. That is what Jesus wants us to do, more than talking, because everyone can talk the same words but not everyone can stand by his words by putting them into action. So I simply encourage everyone to broaden your sense of loving, hoping, and charity. I hope you accept that the ncw way of evangelizing isn't the only way to evangelize, there are many different ways.
Deletekeith xuerebJanuary 31, 2015 at 4:21 PM
DeleteYes...many different ways to evangelize.
Perhaps what is mistaken many times is we do not acknowledge who opens the way....who leads the way to evangelization...the Spirit.
Yes...yes...I am generous....charitable.....I help the Church...I do all these things. Many people evangelize in this way. Many often.....to raise their self esteem....to be acknowledged.....make it a point to tell others of their evangelization.
This is not the evangelization of the Spirit but of man.
Scripture says to go proclaim my word and if you have too....speak.
It did not say to wait around for a thank you.
JSB
What I find absolutely baffling is how the news of Benaventes corruption makes people criticize the way. The news issue is not discussed. Why is that?
ReplyDeleteFUNNY how when the truth and facts are told about the benavente corruption, there are some who say 'be nice to him, he's a good priest!'. BUT, when they attack the archbishop, the shepherd, I don't hear them cry foul.
DeleteStrange how benavente corruption is accepted and these same folks demand TRANSPARENCY. Yet when the corruption is revealed, they accuse the chancery of maligning benavente. HELLO? these are THE facts.
It seems that innuendo and calumnies have been turned into truth (by way of Rohr and CCOG and Toves); and the truth of the evidence of corruption done by benavente are turned into mere conjectures. This is what is called the 'DICTATORSHIP OF RELATIVISM'. What is false is turned into truth and what is true is suppressed as calumny.
Anon 4:29PM you forgot to mention Chuck White.
DeletePopes francis said. Be quiet. And pray.. Should we stop fueling ourselves with these answer and defend and everything they throw at us? I
ReplyDeleteDiana tim writes in his latest post...
ReplyDelete"However, any reasonably bright person knows that the devil is in the details and in this case the "devils" are Archbishop Apuron, Giuseppe and Claudia Gennarini, and Angelo Poschetti. These are the four members of the Board of Guarantors, who, as per Article IX of the RMS articles of incorporation...
"
This is just to show folks that Tim has no class or respect with any human being. FOLKS as evidence, pray for this guy and see what he wrote below.
ReplyDeleteTimJanuary 30, 2015 at 4:42 PM
At 4:36. It's hard for me to believe you are really that stupid. So I'm assuming you are a Kiko trying to set me up. Sorry. Won't work. But for the others. No. It is not your fault. You have no way of knowing what the priest intends so you can't be culpable. However, since I know what they do in private - which is to simply disobey what Rome requires - then I have a duty to myself and my children to at least seek out a priest who will celebrate Mass as Rome requires - whether in private or in public.
AnonymousJanuary 30, 2015 at 5:25 PM
4.36. Not sure you are sincere or not. However, Tim gives an excellent answer in 4.42pm.Holy mass must be celebrated by a priest who acts in his intention in unity with the mind of the church. Certainly best to avoid mass by any priests who does not intend to carry out the intention of the church in any Sacramemt.
AnonymousJanuary 30, 2015 at 6:06 PM
4:36 stop trying to be clever because you Neos are now under a microscope. It has been noted that the NCW presbyter tailor their celebrations because they know how to say the traditional mass (for the non neos) and the Kiko mass complete with flowers on the altar, tambourines, hand clapping, guitar strumming, and Kiko approved songs. Traditional mass lasts about an hour while a Kiko event lasts 2 to 3 hours, depending on how many step up to talk story. They deviate from prescribed communion practice (more like in defiance of the Vatican's wishes). But you know all this, you buffoon
Anon 5:25 PM - The validity of mass depends on the form, words and intention of the priest. of course the matter must be licit as well. Other than that, the mass could be done in a church, a hospital bedside, a chapel, a home, the airport, at a mall or in a stadium or parish hall. It could be on a table with or without flowers; with or without musical instruments, even with or without clapping. Of course we need a validly ordained priest who is able to validly celebrate.
DeleteWe cannot reduce the 'mind' of the church to the myopic and tunnel vision mentality of a person like Tim Rohr. That would be an insult to the church and also to the mind.
The so-called traditional mass is the tridentine mass. Which during the time of Trent was not the 'traditional' way of the mass at that time. Recall that prior to Trent there were many other rites in Europe that pre-dated the mass of Trent. Trent was a novelty when it was introduced and standardized for the Latin Rite. Also recall that there are other rites in the Easter Church that are more 'traditional' than the mass of Trent.
Anon 12:56 am, are you stating facts? Please cite the source of the validity of the mass depending on form and that it could be celebrated (done) anywhere. I would like to forward your comment and pending citation to the Archbishop. Thanks in advance.
DeleteAnon 2:42 pm - Where and when did the Pope say that? What is the date and place?
ReplyDeleteNever in the history of the church here in Guam has one priest stolen so much money. NEVER. And you expect the people to cover their eyes and pretend nothing ever happened? We're supposed to believe that is was the bishop who was mean-spirited and wanted to malign Msgr. Jim? What really is the truth?
I realize the news is a shock and a scandal. We cannot hide it under the rug and pretend it will go away. We need to learn from our mistakes, or else we are bound to report history. Imagine if another priest, far far far more worse than Msgr, Jim will appear and then what? Remember what a famous thinker said about those who have not leanred from History. They are bound to repeat it. Do we want more Msgr. Jims, more rohrs and richard untalans and chuck whites ruining the church?
Think "Hasso" Guam!
Many of you attacking Benavente seem like you have been desperate for a long time, for anything that is in favor of the NCW. Then this fake, not signed, partially true report comes out and you attack like a starving pack of wolves. The problem for you all is that most of the truly faithful know the truth. We don't believe anything from you folks because the actions of your leaders has erased any kind of credibility they may have deceived us for in the past. Worst of all, their blind followers ignore all the truths and attack innocent people; trading their souls for their little fraternity.
DeleteEvil never wins in the end. The time will come when all is made right, and we will always welcome back our strayed brothers and sisters
Dear Anonymous at 7:09 am,
DeleteIf Monsignor James is innocent, then Richard Untalan and the rest of the finance council should refute the numbers at the steps of the Cathedral just like they did the last time. So, where are they??
Why remove Martinez and replace with Claros?
DeleteAnon 7:09 The facts point to the truth. the truth is that the priest who was responsible used the money (given to the church by people who worked hard to buy a decent resting place for their loved ones) for his own personal ends and not for what the money was intended of in the first place. It was essentially an abuse of the rightful property of the church.
DeleteThe focus of the attention is on the acts of irresponsible and reckless use of money that was not the priest's own to use for personal reasons in the first place. I don't think the authorities of the church want to attack the person essentially, but they want to show to the people the problems the church is undergoing in terms of the finances of these two entities.
This is at the very least an exercise in financial transparency and it just so happens that the person responsible for this is Msgr. Benavente. If it was another priest who did the exact same or similar acts, then that person will be called to accountability in the same manner. This is a common practice in the business world.
The church is concerned about the acts which brought the finances to this state of affairs. Unfortunately, it so happens that Msgr. Benavente is the person to whom this fiasco points to. Accountability and transparency can be pointed and at times personally hurtful, but its goal is to account for the acts of financial abuse. There has been a public demand, especially from CCOG, to have financial transparency in the Archdiocese. The report review is exactly just that. For this reason the people have a right to know the facts of this case.
They have been asked and are obeying Diana. For the sake of uniting this Archdiocese, they are refraining from engaging in back and forth Q & A that seem to only results in hurt feelings and further division on both sides. They are letting the process run its course and everyone here should do the same. So that you don't feel foolish when all is said and done, do the right and sane thing and do not be quick to judge, do not hurry to cast the first stone.
DeleteAs believers in the one true faith in our awe awe thisome God, this is a great opportunity for everyone to practice humility, mercy and forgiveness so that we may fully come to appreciate and understand the Love and Grace that God has given everyone of us through His Son. Peace be with all of you this day and always!
Ok, lets just say for example that Msgr. Jim is innocent. All the facts of mismanagement and money missing were just false accusations made by a mean and angry bishop who is hell bent on revenge.
ReplyDeleteOk, let's say that the review report was all a lie. Okay? Let play out the scene. I Wrote the following for your enjoyment: I FEEL INSPIRED NOW TO WRITE: HANG ON! READ:
"AN ODE TO TIM HORROR"
"Where are the defenders of thy holy servant James?
Where are the prayer vigils, the processions, the press conferences,
the justified anger and sanctimonious divine wrath of the goddess of truth and justice?
Where are the holy prayers calling heaven to witness the gross injustice of the bishop on a poor an innocent priest who tried his best? Where is the good and holy christian mother, K. Kasperbauer, to call upon the saints to strike holy Hell upon the Archbishop?
Hark, I hear the clamor of the righteous say:
Let thy heavens render thy judgement upon thy servants!
Is there anyone who will defend against the false accusations laid upon thy poor servant, JAMES?
Pour down thy righteous wrath upon the wicked pharisee Anthony
who prey upon the savings of widows and steal from the plates of orphans!
May thy thunderous anger consume them to dust! Strike, O heavens,
thy fire upon the seat of Anthony and his minions!
Let these scoundrels be burned like fire gleaming in the dark night of Gehenna!
Strike thy lightning upon the heads of those who plot against thy holy
and innocent anointed one, thy faithful servant James, the holy and just one.
Lo, restore thy holy and immaculate servant James to his just reward to wear thy
holy mitre, to put on thy holy ring and hand his staff to drive from thy sight forevermore
all who follow the evil and treacherous Kiko from Spain.
Yes, Yes, O Lord, give thy holy one, James, the power - the power - the power
of thy church! Save us from the heresies of Kiko!
Pour forth thy holy vengeance upon Anthony, the lowest of all forms
and degrade his seat down to the netherworld, where there will be
wailing and grinding of bones.
Bless thy servant and Holy Knight, Timothy Rohr, thy faithful servant of thy holy bookstore
upon whom was granted increase of payroll and deductions.
Grant him Lord that he may receive his just share of the W-2 form;
Grant that Revenue and Tax may give him increase of tax returns;
grant him strength to fight that treacherous and evil Vicar, David, whose
name we abhor with disdain and spittle upon our lips!
May he find more land to sell for thy profit.
These all we ask in the name of thy holy and most enlightened servant, the
holy man of Law, disbarred nonetheless, Richard of Untalan.
AMEN.
Whew, what poetic license!
Anyway, it's all quiet here on the Cathedral steps.
No protests, no conferences, no statements. No clarion calls to
write the Vatican and the Kremlin.
Folks? What happened?
Is the Financial Review then really TRUE?
Anon @ 12:40 am -- Be careful what you pray for.
DeleteI am just curious how the finance counsel will spin the report.
DeleteThey are the ones who should be praying.
Amen, Anonymous @Jan.31 2:03pm
ReplyDelete