The episcopal council of the Rome diocese, in a document distributed March 1, said the unity of the diocese - seen especially through the unity of the bishop and pastors of parishes in the celebration of the Eucharist - is especially important to emphasize during the triduum: the Holy Thursday Mass of the Lord’s Supper, the Good Friday liturgy of the Lord’s Passion and the Easter vigil Saturday night.
“To express visibly the unity of the holy people of God and express the deepest meaning of belonging to an ecclesial community,” the council said, those who frequent non-parish churches, chapels and oratories or who belong to special groups, associations or new movements “are exhorted to take part in the celebrations of the Easter triduum in parish churches.”
An exception exists for “national churches,” like the U.S. Catholic community at St. Patrick Church in Rome, and for members of the Neocatechumenal Way, whose Vatican-approved statutes allow for small-group celebrations of the Easter vigil, Midili said.Yes, brothers and sisters, an EXCEPTION exists for the members of the Neocatechumenal Way. Our approved statutes had always allowed us to celebrate the Easter Vigil in small communities.
Also, a priest in Japan was diagnosed with cancer. I believe his name was Father Miguel.....correct me if I am wrong. The acoustics in the church was terrible, and I had trouble hearing where we were sitting. According to the doctors, he does not have much time left. At any rate, this priest is very happy. His community and family have traveled from afar to visit him. They saw how happy he was despite his terminal illness. He had a smile on his face. Why is he happy? "Because," he said, "He is going to meet Jesus very soon." And he is eager to meet Him that he does not feel the pain or suffering. A Christian leaves this world happy, knowing that he will be in his true home. Even the Apostles went to their deaths, singing with joy. Our true home is in God's kingdom for we are citizens of Heaven, and heirs to His kingdom.
And what does Archbishop Byrnes say to Guam's NCW celebrating their own Easter Vigil? Is he allowing it; and, if he is, (did they ask?) would he not stipulate that the Mass has to be in line with their approved Statutes? This would mean that the NCW would not be allowed to use their "alterations" to the Mass, as this was why Archbishop Brynes had corrected the NCW in the first place. And if the Guam NCW must celebrate their Mass without all of their "alterations", they don't really need a separate Mass, do they??
ReplyDeletePeace - One Body in Christ
Dear One Body in Christ,
DeleteArchbishop Byrnes changed the Mass not because of us.....but because of people like you. The NCW have been following Archbishop Byrnes' instructions regarding the Mass. He wanted us to celebrate before a consecrated altar, and we have been doing that. The Mass is inside the Church building. He wanted us to consume the Body of Christ immediately after we receive it, and that is what we are doing. After all, was that not what YOU complained about?
And when all the parishes are sold, YOU won't have a building, tabernacle, or consecrated altar. After everything is sold, you will have nothing. But the NCW will still be standing.
As I said, we have always followed the Archbishop of the Archdiocese of Agana. And I am sure that Archbishop Byrnes will follow the Holy See's March 1st letter.
Peace
Dear ONE BODY IN CHRIST
DeleteThe NCW already has the permission of ArchBishop Byrnes to celebrate the Mass in the small communities. His Letter(3.15.17 prot. no. 2017-074) directing the NCW communities to use a consecrated altar, consume the Sacred species immediately after receiving and that there shall be a pause in the forming of new communities for about a year.
We have been obedient to his directive since then and hope that one day soon he will allow us to again spread the Word of God to the peripheries of our local church.
I encourage you to get to know Holy Mother Church before you decide to accuse of alterations. You'd be surprised at the alterations that you unknowingly take part in every Sunday. As for the NCW alterations, these also have approval, as referenced by Archbishop Byrnes in that same letter.
Your name "One Body in Christ" reminds us that although many parts, we are ALL ONE BODY. Every time you attend a Mass, your prayers are united with everyone and vise versa. The prayers in the NCW are of the church because we are one, not separate.
Although you didnt specifically mention it, I am suspect to say that the Mass is more than just another obligation. Its not just "another" Mass, at "another" time with "another" group of people.
I encourage you to read the Document from the Congregation of Divine Worship entitled "Paschalis Sollemnitatis" Section 7. After reading this section concerning the "night of all nights" the Easter Vigil, ask yourself who is the one altering?
Peace
Pas!
-Jokers Wild
Dear Diana, I hope I am alowed to speak in this matter.
DeleteDear Zoltan,
DeleteI will not allow any jungle propaganda in my blog. The person can always go to the jungle for that.
Are you saying my comment is jungle propaganda?
DeleteDear Zoltan,
DeleteThat depends. I have read a lot of the jungle that I know what they preach. And if you repeat the things they say, it becomes propaganda because they only have their assumptions and misinterpretations.
Diana, you are not right. Jungle has never said what I am saying.
DeleteAccording to the jungle:
DeleteNow on to another "give away" in this blurb. Why are their celebrations "two hours long?" Because of their so-called "echoes," which is their version of a homily where members of the community drone on and on about what the readings mean to them etc., etc., etc.......
So as you can clearly see, any additional instruction, admonition, testimony, whatever is to be "brief," "occasional," "in exceptional circumstances," "on particular days," AND "should not become a regular practice."
http://www.junglewatch.info/2017/03/they-lie-they-lie-they-lie-they-lie.html?m=1
RIGHT....ON......"DIANA" "+" :))
DeleteZoltan is saying the same thing as the jungle. He attacks the echos because jungle told him so. He probably made a deal with them. It is sheer jungle propaganda. This the next line of attack. They say it is not approved while we presented all evidence that echos are APPROVED. Period. I am not attacking Zoltan in person, especially if he is still walking. His catechist could tell. I am only questioning his motivation. I am critical of his statement that has no justification. I know he is an intellectual person. We are all sinners. But NCW is the home of many intellectuals who found Jesus Christ among us, in the Way! As St Paul says in 1 Cor 1, 18-21:
DeleteIt is written, “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the discernment of the discerning I will thwart.” Where is the one who is wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, God decided, through the foolishness of our proclamation, to save those who believe.
Dear Diana, I don't think it is right what Zoltan says here. But I would not say he is part of the jungle.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 12:58 pm,
DeleteI never said that he was part of the jungle. I said that if he repeats jungle propaganda, I will not publish it. The echoes were approved and it can be found in Arinze's letter, which Zoltan misunderstood. According to Arinze's letter:
It is permitted to have a brief instruction that helps explain better the liturgy that is being celebrated, and even, in exceptional circumstances, a few testimonies, as long as these conform to the liturgical norms, are offered on the occasion of Eucharistic liturgies celebrated on particular days (for seminarians, the sick, etc.), and are thought truly helpful as an illustration of the regular homily delivered by the celebrating priest. These instructions and testimonies must not assume characteristics that might cause them to be confused with the homily.”
Arinze called the echoes "testimonies", and mentioned the Eucharist, not word celebration.
Dear Diana, this can be unserstood against candor, as well, as imagine less than one half of what the jungle says is true. Then, you see with fairness which half is that. I quoted Sr. Louise O'Rourke who is considered a canon lawyer. I follow her counsel in this matter. I don't think she has ever heard of the jungle. Do you have a criteria of how do you tell which half is true what she says?
DeleteDear Zoltan,
DeleteThe NCW follows the Pope and Archbishop Byrnes, not Sr. Louise O'Rourke. We also do not follow the jungle. Archbishop Byrnes already gave instructions to the RMS priests as to how to do the Mass in our celebration. And Archbishop Byrnes did NOT take out the echoes.
Who is Sr. Louise O'Rourke? I have never heard of her. She must be one of the anti-NCW propagandists.
Deletehttps://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=663883191
Dear Anonymous, Sister Louise is a religious sister of the Disciples of the Divine Master in Ireland. She currently ministers the Archdiocese of Dublin as a canon lawyer and as the Assistant Vicar for Religious.
DeleteYou may read about her here:
https://www.thejournal.ie/year-of-consecrated-life-1911456-Jan2015/
While at the St. Paul University in Ottawa, Sister Louise wrote a scholarly paper from the point of view of the canon lawyer. It is no secret what she wrore about the Neocatechumenal Way. It has nothing pro or con or propagandistic. She only wrore down the facts that her scholarly research found. I don't know what could be the point of questioning her credentials.
https://www.academia.edu/18001423/An_exploration_of_the_liturgical_variations_permitted_for_use_by_the_Neo-Catechumenate_Way
Dear Zoltan,
DeleteShe can write whatever she wants about the Way, but the Way is not going to follow her. She is not the Pope nor the Archbishop of the Archdiocese of Agana. Furthermore, her research into the NCW is lacking. She did not interview Kiko Arguello nor the congregation that approved the Statutes and Directory. All she did was look at letters and documents. That is all her research amounted to. She did not even observe nor sit in any NCW celebrations.
The NCW is over 50 years old. If we are doing something litugically wrong, the Vatican would have corrected us by now. In fact, Pope Benedict XVI did conduct an investigation into the NCW and how they celebrate the Mass. Nothing wrong was discovered and Pope Francis ceased the investigation.
Dear Zoltan, she might be a scholar, but why should we follow her? I see you are a scholar at the university. But she is not even the founder of NCW, so that she might dictate to us. Why does she prescribe to the NCW what is good and wrong? She did not even interview our founderm who is still well and alive! Did she try to contact him? What kind of scholarship is that? In her recklessless, how could she have any clue about the Way?
DeleteAd.1 A Canon Lawyer writes about the Holy Liturgy 😁
DeleteAd. 2 The research paper (yes it is a research paper) was written 2013.
Some people have this obsession when they see new things what we do in our communities. It is none of their business, but they still want to interfere by any means. They are scared of anything new, this gives them the cold feet because they are living in their own limited reality. I am not talking about the jungle group and its people only.
DeleteThey come against the NCW relentlessly because they cannot accept that God has a plan for us. I sense the same fear in sister Louise. She is attacking NCW because her mind is too much closed in her own religious group the Disciples of Masters. Perhaps NCW was given permission for things that her group has never got. It is like being jealous that we don't follow her order but we follow our own itinerary. I'm sorry sister Louise, your reality is just not the same as mine. You have to wake up and smell the roses. I hope we can live with that in peace.
Dear Anonymous, your creative speculation about the sister is baseless and unfair. She is not attacking the NCW and her affiliation to the Disciples of the Divine Master is unrelated to her scholarly work. She has never asked anybody to follow her. Why would she do that? By your assumption you misunderstand the nature of scholarly research. It is not about interviewing people. Without taking sides, she only presented the facts that can be found in document depositories and archives. I believe you owe an apology to sister Louise.
DeleteDear Zoltan,
DeleteI find her research lacking in many things. She did not interview the founder of the NCW nor any member of the NCW. She did not observe with her own eyes how the NCW celebrated the Mass. She did not get the input of the Congregation that approved it's Statutes and Directories. The extent of her research was limited only to letters and documents.
First of all, the founder of the NCW has not been interviewed. What kind of scholarship is that? Document depositories and archives are not the living faith. Our faith lives in our communities. How can you "explore" liturgical variations if you don't even ask? Those variation were introduced by Kiko Arguello, in the first place, founder and international catechist of the Way. Who else is a better authority than him?
DeleteCatholic faith has never been in books only, but alive in the world! Our reality can be "explored" only if you accept reality among us, beyond the books. Our reality is our faith as Saint Pope John-Paul II recognized NCW as valid initiation into Catholic faith in the world for our time. I emphazise the reality part that cannot be hidden in dusty document depositories.
Dear Diana, is it not Zoltan who came up against Archbishop Apuron, Father Pius and the communities of the Way in the PDN?! Wow, what is he doing in the NCW? You see he was just hiding behind Sister Louise, but he has his own plan. Zoltan is on the front page of JungleWatch now! What is his true color? What is his reality? He says:
Delete"The Way is part of the new evangelization efforts of the Catholic Church. After a time of reforms and renewal, its Catholic character will shine up again from its local communities. It has a bright future on Guam, in peaceful coexistence with other parish groups and religious movements. Once openness and transparency take over its higher echelons, its conformity and mission inside the Catholic Church will be ensured.
Zoltan Szekely is a resident of Yona"
Dear Anonymous at 2:05 PM, I have read the PDN. What Zoltan says about Archbishop Apuron is the same that was announced by Pope Francis. He did not even mention Fr. Pius. I give kudos for his bravety. It is surprising but he is accepting NCW as the new evangelization. Vatican has declared the same! He says, NCW's Catholic mission is ensured. Is this not true?
DeleteDear Anonymous at 3:21 pm,
DeleteBased on his letter, it is obvious that Zoltan has taken it upon himself to change everything about the Way as though he knows better. He thinks the Way should change it’s philosophy, morality, and religious practices. Zoltan is in my community in Chalan Pago. He says the NCW is the New Evangelization, but not once has Zoltan ever participated in the 2 by 2 mission or the Great Mission.
Dear Anonymous at 3:21 pm and 3:43 pm,
DeleteWe need to pray for Zoltan. That is all we can do.
Does anyone know if Zoltan participate in the NCW pilgrimages or help out with the youth scrutacio? Does he help out his Chalan Pago parish cuz as far as I know Fr. Carl and many parishioners has been supportive of the Way in Chalan Pago.
DeleteZoltan's walk with his Chalan Pago community is sporadic. His walk is no different than other brothers who sometimes come to celebrations. Zoltan came for the 2nd Scrutiny convivence but chose not to participate in the scrutinies. Again, other brothers likewise chose not to be scrutinized. It is admirable that Zoltan participates since he has a hearing disability. Must be exhausting to try to understand what brothers say through his hearing aid and by trying to read lips. Each of us walk in the Way as we choose to.
DeleteDear Anonymous at 4:33 pm,
DeleteI agree. Thank you. Everyone walks differently in the Way. None of us are perfect. We are no different than our brothers who do not walk in the Way. We need to pray for Zoltan and for each other. We need to strengthen each other rather than make judgments.
I remember the catechists saying something to the effect of not needing to defend ourselves, not resisting the persecution but dont hesitate to tell the truth. I hope this is our intention whenever we come one here and comment. Atleast for me, this is my purpose.
DeleteIt is very possible that it is their goal for us to turn against one another, let us avoid this by not judging.
I notice that several of you who walk with Zoltan in community have shared your experience of him, a judgement. I think that maybe those judgments are something that you should take up personally with Him, the next time he comes around. This blog is not the place for it, atleast that is my opinion.
I have noticed that throughout these past few years there have been those that have left community but at the same time, so many have come back, those that were away for so long. This is beautiful.
We all have our own definitions of what the IDEAL Walk is suppose to be. I think this is something that is always evolving because God reveals himself to us in many different ways and the Spirit moves in its own accord. What matters is that we continue to walk.
Pas!
-Jokers Wild
Yep. Now the jungle is gearing up its campaign against the Way. Nevermind that we've continued to follow Byrnes' instructions regarding the Mass. Just goes to show that they just want the NCW dead.
ReplyDeleteExactly. And the first propaganda they have published is that the NCW controls the government of Guam with the election of Lou Leon Guerrero. How they managed to come up with that is beyond me. Lou Leon Guerrero gained more than 15,000 votes. Does the jungle actually believe that the NCW have 15,000 voting members? 🙄
DeleteTim already lost his credibility cuz of the sex abuse allegations against him. Looking at his Facebook page, he's a very sad lonely man reminiscing of the past and of precious things he lost. I pity the man. He's delusional in thinking he's doing God's will. He can't see that it was never God's will to make innocent people suffer through the loss of their parishes nor Tim's family to turn against him. That's the work of the devil.
Delete"When all the parishes are sold, YOU won't have a building, tabernacle, or consecrated altar. After everything is sold, you will have nothing."
ReplyDeleteDear Diana, I believe the Catholic Church has impunity to protect those assets.
I thank God for your obedience to Archbishop Brynes who was sent by Pope Francis to Guam in regards to the Most Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. These corrections were needed; please do not be offended by them or feel belittled by them. I, too, need correction at times. None of us is perfect, and as the One Body of Christ, we should rejoice with one another for the good that each does (and I admit that the NCW has MANY good gualities), but we should also be willing to be better. If correction is needed and guidance is given, each of us should be happy that the other member of the One Body of Christ loves us enough to correct us.
ReplyDeleteExcerpt of the letter of Mar 15 2017 to the NCW from Archbishop Byrnes:
“The sooner we have unity and universal adherence as an archdiocese to the norms established by the Church in celebrating the body of Christ during the sacred celebration of the Mass, the sooner we shall be on the path to reconciling with one another and bring healing to our divided diocese,” Archbishop Byrnes said.
The archbishop recognized the good that the movement has brought to many people’s lives and he noted that it is recognized and approved by the Holy See.
"However, it is imperative that it adhere to liturgical norms, he (Byrnes) said, and this adherence “will only enrich the fruits of the Neocatechumenal movement.”
This statement reiterates Pope Benedict's desire in his letter of 2006 when he said, "Precisely to help the Neocatechumenal Way to render EVEN MORE EFFECTIVE ITS EVANGELIZING ACTION IN COMMUNION WITH ALL THE PEOPLE OF GOD, THE CONGREGATION FOR DIVINE WORSHIP AND THE DISCIPLINE OF THE SACRAMENTS RECENTLY IMPARTED TO YOU IN MY NAME CERTAIN NORMS CONCERNING THE EUCHARISTIC CELEBRATION, AFTER THE TRIAL PERIOD THAT THE SERVANT OF GOD JOHN PAUL II CONCEDED. I AM SURE YOU WILL ATTENTIVELY OBSERVE THESE NORMS THAT REFLECT WHAT IS PROVIDED FOR IN THE LITURGICAL BOOKS APPROVED BY THE CHURCH. BY FAITHFULLY KEEPING TO EVERY CHURCH DIRECTIVE, YOU WILL MAKE YOUR APOSTOLATE even more effective, in tune and in full communion with the Pope and the Pastors of every Diocese. And in so doing, the Lord will continue to bless you with abundant pastoral fruits."
Peace - ONE BODY IN CHRIST
Dear One Body in Christ,
DeleteOur obedience would not matter to those whose only goal is to kill the NCW. As I said, we have always been obedient to the Archbishop of the Archdiocese of Agana. Archbishop Byrnes did not change our celebration because we were doing it wrong. He changed it to appease people like you in the hopes That you would get rid of your prejudices.
As anyone who reads the jungle, they are already starting the campaign to get rid of the NCW. And if Archbishop Byrnes happens to do something the jungle does not like, they would oppose him. In fact, they already criticized his decision to divide the parishes into four areas. Therefore, you are posting in the wrong blog.
Posting in the wrong blog? Are you saying that you and me are not in the One Body of Christ?
ReplyDeleteDianaApril 14, 2019 at 2:30 PM
DeleteDear One Body in Christ,
I said you are posting in the wrong blog. I never said you are not Catholic.
I stated: "Archbishop Byrnes did not change our celebration because we were doing it wrong. He changed it to appease people like you in the hopes That you would get rid of your prejudices."
And you have nothing to say about that.
Hmmmm.....it seems that One Body in Christ doesn't seem to care that JW is setting up a campaign to get rid of the Way. I don't hear him being horrified that JW wants to get rid of the Way. Hmmmm.....
ReplyDeleteONE BODY IN CHRIST,
ReplyDeleteIm not sure what you are still trying to get across. The NCW has been obedient to the Archbishop of Guam and to the Holy See.
I would like to ask you, what exactly are referring to? what are we doing wrong?
I can tell you though that we are walking according to the Statutes that received approval from Rome. If you heard that we are doing things differently, we are, but all within the boundaries of the statute, or is it better to say, ALL ACCORDING TO THE STATUTES.
Im pretty sure diana will end comments on this matter soon because this has been a topic on numerous occasions because some still dont understand or just wont take our word on the matter.
So Basically to sum things up...
The NCW is made up of numerous small communities - APPROVED
THE NCW celebrates a Liturgy of the Word midweek - APPROVED
THE NCW celebrates numerous Eucharists on Saturday nights in small communities - APPROVED
-the Kiss of Peace is moved before the offertory - APPROVED
-there are small admonitions before the readings - APPROVED
-Short echoes(Not homilies or confession) are given by the members - APPROVED
-members remain in their place(do not form lines)to receive communion - APPROVED
-unleavened bread and wine are used - APPROVED
-The NCW itinerary consists of certain steps modeled after the RCIA - APPROVED
These are the only "alterations" some with specific permission granted to the NCW and some that are observed by the churches that wish to. If you heard anything else, its not true or maybe was something that was done during the very early years of the NCW.
The NCW has been around for over 50 years and in these years we have walked very slowly with the guidance and obedience to the Holy See.
In all honesty, if the Parish Mass that you regularly attend undergoes some changes, what more the NCW Mass? All in obedience to ROME.
Pas!
-Jokers Wild
Hi there, I enjoy reading through your article post. I like to write a little comment to support you.
ReplyDelete