The following interview was emailed to me in its translation (the bold is mine).
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INTERVIEW TO KIKO
ARGUELLO ON THE MEETING WITH RABBIS AT THE DOMUS GALILEAE
Last Thursday ended in Israel, the international meeting of
Christian-Jewish rabbis, cardinals and bishops, promoted by the Neocatechumenal
Way, on the occasion of the 50th anniversary of the Declaration Nostra Aetate
and in remembrance of the 70th anniversary of the end of the Holocaust. It was
held at the Domus Galilaeae, on the Sea of Galilee and was attended by 120
rabbis, 7 Cardinals (Pell, Rylko, Toppo, Schonborn, Cordes, Yeom Soo-jung and
Romeo) and 20 bishops from all over the world. Also present were the Itinerants
of the Way and academics, art and culture personalities of both faiths. Pope
Francis sent a message to highlight and recognize this event as a tool to
strengthen the brotherhood between the two peoples. Roberto Piermarini asked
Kiko Argüello, initiator of the Neocatechumenal how did this interfaith event:
R. - It 'was an idea of the rabbis of New York. Having
realized that the symphony "The suffering of the innocent," at Lincoln
Center, in New York, was greatly loved by the rabbis, they thought to
perform it in Auschwitz, in front of the "Gate of Death", which 60 bishops from Poland, 15 000 brothers and many rabbis attended. Rabbi Rosenbaum, a reformist, was impressed and said he did not want this
relationship of love and communion with the Way to stop. He said, "A few rabbis knew what's going on in the Catholic Church with the
Neocatechumenal Way: this love that you have for the Jewish people, that comes
from the catechumenate of the Christian community. In the Way the deep roots of
our faith are explained: Abraham, the Exodus, the story of salvation and so on.
" Then he said: "Why not do a meeting at Domus, inviting more
rabbis: all the rabbis of Europe and the world?". And I said: "Oh my,
it's hard! But, all right! You write ". Then he and Rabbi Greenberg, who
has a lot of prestige, wrote a letter of invitation to all the rabbis, for
these days of May, which was signed by me, two rabbis, and Cardinal
O'Malley, Cardinal Cañizares and Rabbi Rosen, who were in charge of the relationship
between Catholicism and Judaism. We waited, therefore, to see what happened and
the surprise was that 120 rabbis from all over the world showed up. It 'was
great! They also came from several branches: Orthodox, liberal, reformists. It
was 'the first time they were together, "and this - they say - it is a miracle
that only the Catholics could do."
R. - We performed the symphony, singing "Shema
Israel" together. Some were crying, really excited, because the Talmud says: "The
day that Catholics, the goyim, with the Jews, will sing the Shema Israel, the
Messiah comes." Therefore, They were, all impressed. Then we made a
questionnaire for groups, which stirred the bishops, cardinals and rabbis. One of the
questions was: "What is the saving mission of the Jewish people and the Catholic
Church at this time in the world?" We explained how the Way is opening now to
Asia - China, Laos, Vietnam, Cambodia - and how we are carrying the Torah and the Gospel which is the light to the world to all these nations, that were
under communism. They were very impressed and united. We are united in this
great mission.
Q. - What has been the response of the rabbis?
R. - Fantastic! Fantastic! Rabbi Brodman, one of the most
important rabbis, said: "This is an event that shows that the Messiah is
coming." Then they said wonderful things: they loved the beauty of Domus
Galilaeae that welcomed them ... then the songs. We danced, because these days it
recurred the end of Lag Ba'omer, is a time of mourning commemorating the sacrifice
of Rabbi Akiva. There is a moment, when it ends the Lag Ba'omer, in which they
do a great fire in all the synagogues and dance. We did it here, dancing
together: cardinals, bishops, and all rabbis. It 'was exciting! They could not
believe their eyes to what was going on. It's really an historical fact. So
they want to continue this relationship with us. One thing that most impressed
them was the passage of the faith to new generations, because they have many
problems on this. Young people, in fact, become secularized. We screened a
video that explained how the passage of faith is done in the Way. They were
impressed on how parents can explain to their children the Word; how they ask
them: what does this Word say to you today in your life? They remained so
impressed and want us to help them in this.
The director of Domus Galilaeae, the center of the
Neocatechumenal Way in Galilee, Don Rino Rossi, one of the organizers of the
event, explains the highlights of this historic 'meeting.
R. - Certainly the presentation hit them very much, because
it was made by the itinerants of the Neocatechumenal Way of the various nations
that presented to the rabbis, giving their experience - even briefly - these
itinerant presented, for example, their situation of conjugates perhaps with 8,
10, 12 children ... This has created an impressive impact in the rabbis, who
recalled it in their experiences. Then, of course, one thing that has struck
them much was the concert of the Symphony of the Innocents The orchestra has
come here, and I have seen many rabbis cry. They were very touched. Then,
another important moment was the questionnaire, where they could talk and tell
their experiences, but above all there was the exchange between cardinals,
bishops, the itinerant catechists and rabbis.
Q. - There was a common prayer?
R. - We had Vespers, led by a rabbi, Wednesday night,
in all their forms, in which we participated. Then, on Thursday morning, they also wished that they could pray as Christians, and we did Lauds, presided
over by Cardinal Schönborn, with psalms, with a reading of the prophet Isaiah,
and Chapter 60, 1-5, with a homily made Cardinal Schönborn which was very
welcome.
Q. - At the end of the meeting what has been the
reaction of the rabbis?
R. - We received exciting experiences. A Rabbi of
Israel, Rabbi David Brodman, started giving an experience that moved the
assembly. He spoke of this meeting as a crucial meeting, of this relationship
between the Catholic Church and the Jewish world that he never could have
expected. He said: "This was my dream. I wanted - and the Lord gives me,
at the end of my life - to see these things. " He cited a book by a rabbi
who is very important to him; He said that we are in a time when we are
experiencing "labor pains" to prepare for the arrival of the Messiah
in our midst, and he's already seeing all this; Also in this meeting, he saw it
as a preparation for this coming of the Messiah. Then there was another rabbi
of Holland who also told his experience as a child he was saved by a Christian
family. And also speaking of this meeting, he said: "I have really seen
God work in our midst." Another rabbi who said: "I tell you frankly,
that I realized something, listening to Kiko. I in my family, in my tradition,
I never heard that God loves us ", and said with a force that moved the
assembly. "I saw him here, in this house. - He said - I saw him really in
the facts: how they welcomed us ... ", in the experiences that I have
heard in the groups, how these couples spoke, these families, these brothers of
the Neocatechumenal Way, saying with their lives, how God loved them, how
he had redeemed them, saved them ... He said: "Well here, I asked my wife:
'But you, for example, have you heard from someone in your life, in the
synagogue, this word, that God loves us? '". And his wife said to him:
"No, I have not ever heard, ever heard!". And the rabbi said:
"Me too ...". Also the
experience of Rabbi Greenberg of the United States was very moved. The
environment that was created at the end you cannot describe it, really! Then,
we also had very familiar times, we had dances ... there was a spirit of
communion that was very strong!
Wow, I had no idea how bad this apostasy had gotten. This is truly the work of the devil in the midst of the Catholic Church.
ReplyDeleteWe saw Rabbi Kligler's comments on another post here the other day - pointing out that he was one of the rabbis contacted at the last minute to make up the numbers - and here we have Kiko explaining what a surprise and a miracle it was to have 120 rabbis just suddenly show up. This should give an indication to anyone with eyes to see.
And who is this Messiah that they are talking about? Certainly not Jesus Christ who will return as he left ie in clouds of glory and like the lightning flashing from east to west. No, this Messiah they are referring to is none other than the Anti-Christ, who is prophesied to appear as the savior, and who will be accepted by the Jewish people. We should be having no congress with this error.
The rest? Well to say its not Catholic would be the understatement of the year.
Dear Anonymous at 10:38 am,
DeleteBoth the Christian and Jews are waiting for the same Messiah. For Christians, we are waiting for Jesus' Second coming because He promised us that He will come again. The Jews, on the other hand, are also waiting for the Messiah.....the same Messiah that was predicted to come in the Old Testament. They will be surprised on that day when Jesus comes.
Sorry, but the Jews are not waiting for the same Messiah:
Delete"The Jewish Messiah is to be a human being born naturally to husband and wife. He is not to be a god, nor a man born of supernatural or virgin birth, as the Christians claim. Nowhere does our Bible say that the Messiah would be a god or G-d-like. The very idea that G-d would take on human form is repulsive to Jews because it contradicts our concept of G-d as being above and beyond the limitations of the human body and situation. Jews believe that G-d alone is to be worshiped, not a being who is His creation, be he angel, saint, or even the Messiah himself. Nowhere does the Bible predict that the Messiah will be born to a virgin. In fact, virgins never give birth anywhere in the Bible. This idea is to be found only in pagan mythology. To the Jewish mind, the very idea that G-d would plant a seed in a woman is unnecessary and unnatural."
"The Jewish Messiah is expected to return the Jews to their land. Jesus was born while the Jews still lived in their land, before they had gone into exile. He could not restore them to their land because they were still living in it!
The true Messiah is to rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem but Jesus lived while the Temple was still standing."
http://www.whatjewsbelieve.org/explanation3.html
http://www.jewsforjudaism.ca/publications/books-booklets---text-only/the-real-messiah-by-aryeh-kapla
The Catechism states the following (please read carefully):
CCC 675 Before Christ's second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers. The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth will unveil the "mystery of iniquity" in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth. The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh.
CCC 676 The Antichrist's deception already begins to take shape in the world every time the claim is made to realize within history that messianic hope which can only be realized beyond history through the eschatological judgment. The Church has rejected even modified forms of this falsification of the kingdom to come under the name of millenarianism, especially the "intrinsically perverse" political form of a secular messianism."
Dear Anonymous at 12:29 pm,
DeleteI find it very sad that some Christians are very anti-Semitic. You seem to have forgotten that Christ was a Jew. Jesus was never a Christian. In fact, none of the 12 Apostles even called themselves "Christians." The first ones to use the name "Christian' were the Gentile converts in Antioch. Christianity came from Judaism, and the Holy Bible states that the branch is holy because the root is holy. Judaism was the holy root that gave rise to Christianity.
You seem to have forgotten that Judaism is fulfilled by Christ. And that the Judaism that followed the Christian era is not the same as that which preceded it. Talmudic Judaism is the codification of that religion which rejects Jesus Christ as Messiah. This doesn't mean that those that follow that religion are bad or worse sinners than anyone else. That religious system is based on a lie, though - namely that Jesus is not the Messiah, not the savior of the world, and that there is another one to come in the flesh.
DeleteAnti-Semitism is not to be identified with a criticism of the modern Judaism. Rather anti-Semitism is a discrimination or general criticism against the "race" of Jewish people, whether they are religiously observant or not. You would not be able to find any example of Anti-Semitism in these posts, as there has been no remarks made about Jews as a familial people, or their ancestry. Instead the only remarks here relate to the specific things the modern religious Jewish people believe.
Finally, have you nothing to say about the paragraphs of the catechism quoted above?
Dear Anonymous at 3:52 pm,
DeleteWhere does it say that Judaism was fulfilled by Christ?????
You stated: You would not be able to find any example of Anti-Semitism in these posts, as there has been no remarks made about Jews as a familial people, or their ancestry. Instead the only remarks here relate to the specific things the modern religious Jewish people believe.
Nostra Aetate,was formulated by Pope John Paul VI in 1965. The document Nostra Aetate, defined anti-Semitism as a sin against God and proclaimed, as St. Paul did, that the covenant of God with Israel has never been revoked. Again, let me repeat that this document was written in 1965 and referring to those modern Jews. An anonymous commenter above at 12:29 pm called these modern Jews "anti-Christ." by referring to CCC 676. Essentially, the commenter is already judging that CCC 676 was referring to the entire Jewish people as the anti-Christ. When a person calls a race or group of people the "anti-Christ", they are referring to much more than religious beliefs.
Furthermore, this meeting with the Christians and Rabbis showed that the Jewish people can accept Christ despite that they do not believe he is the Messiah. In other words, they may not believe that Christ is the Messiah, but they did not reject Christ but accepted Him as one of their own Jewish brothers who brought out Christianity. That is the FIRST and right step to take in coming to know Christ. The rest will come later with God doing the work.
Before sending out itinerants and mission families out to evangelize in different countries, they need to be prepared in how to evangelize. One can bring people to know Christ by preaching love rather than by preaching hell fire if they do not believe in Jesus Christ. Look at the astonishment of the Jews who have heard Kiko and the NCW when they preached that God loves them. If they had preached that they would go to Hell for not believing in Jesus Christ, do you honestly think they would continue to meet with us. The fact that the Jews would like to continue to meet with the NCW is already a sign that God is there reaching for His chosen people.
"Where does it say that Judaism was fulfilled by Christ????? "
DeleteGosh, I seriously hope you are joking Diana.
Try Matthew 5.17 :
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets; I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. "
And if that is why he came - what can be made of his statement on the cross that "It is accomplished"?
How about the entire book of Hebrews?
Jesus is the prophetic fulfillment of the Jews. If you are currently a Jew you don't recognize him. As Catholics we are the ones Jesus spoke of throughout his ministry who would inherit salvation that was initially reserved only for the Jews.
In any event, you misread Anon's quoting of the CCC. This is clearly not meant to imply a claim that the race of modern Jews are to be identified as the "anti-Christ". The Catechism (as well as Catholic prophecy) indicates that in the final age the deception of the Anti-Christ, being a religious deception, will be accepted by many people, especially those who have not recognised Jesus as the Messiah.
Look at the following lines again:
"The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth will unveil the "mystery of iniquity" in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth."
"The Antichrist's deception already begins to take shape in the world every time the claim is made to realize within history that messianic hope which can only be realized beyond history through the eschatological judgment"
Ok? So the modern Jewish faith includes the belief that the "messianic hope" is to be "realized within history", whereas the Catholic belief is that the "messianic hope...can only be realized beyond history through the eschatological judgment"
This is a statement about an article of faith, not about a people. But, if in our evangelisation we fail to articulate these fundamental truths, we will be culpable for any who fall prey to the religious deception to which these passages of the CCC refer.
"The fact that the Jews would like to continue to meet with the NCW is already a sign that God is there reaching for His chosen people. "
DeleteWhy do you need more signs that God loves all people? Do you not have the sign of the cross - the manifest love of God through Jesus Christ?
Dear Anonymous at 11:02 am,
DeleteMatthew 5:17 dd not say that Judaism was fulfilled by Christ. It says that Christ fulfilled the law and the prophets.
As for the statement Jesus made at the cross "It is finished"......that also has nothing to do with fulfilling Judaism. In the Passover feast, the Jews have four cups to drink from. Jesus did not drink the fourth cup at the Last Supper. A Jewish person would notice that. The third cup Jesus drank was the cup of blessings, which became His blood. After that, he said "I will not drink this fruit of the vine until the day when I drink it with you new in the kingdom of my Father." (Matthew 26:29). That was the fourth cup he was referring to. At the cross, he drank that fourth cup when wine was offered to his lips at the cross. Then Christ said "It is finished." In the Jewish passover feast, after the fourth cup is drunk, the Father (who is the head of the house) will always say, "It is finished" or "It is consummated."
As for CCC 676, it was never referring to the Jewish people. The Catechism describes who the anti-Christ is. According to CCC 675 (which is just before CCC676), it stated: ".... The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh.576"
So, who is the anti-Christ??? It is the religion that glorifies himself in the place of God. If you ask the Jews who they worship, they will say Yahweh
There is only two religions that glorifies man in the place of God. The first one is atheism. The other religion is the Satanic occult. Atheism says there is no God and that man can solve all his problems and do not need God. Atheism is a religion that rejects God. The Jews, on the other hand, worship Yahweh.
Have you ever heard of Christopher Hitchens, Anonymous? I suggest you look him up. This is not to say that ALL atheists are the anti-Christs. There are some atheists who sincerely seek all things that are good. It is possible that these atheists seeking good can have salvation because all goodness comes from God. As for the Satanic occult, I cannot imagine how anyone can worship Satan.
Dear Anonymous at 11:04 am.
DeleteYou asked "Why do you need more signs that God loves all people?"
Not everyone knows that God loves them. According to Kiko's response:
" He said: "Well here, I asked my wife: 'But you, for example, have you heard from someone in your life, in the synagogue, this word, that God loves us? '". And his wife said to him: "No, I have not ever heard, ever heard!". And the rabbi said: "Me too ..."."
As Christians, we need to spread the word that God loves all people because some people have not heard this.
"Matthew 5:17 dd not say that Judaism was fulfilled by Christ. It says that Christ fulfilled the law and the prophets"
DeleteAnd Judaism is not the "law and prophets"?
Dear Anonymous at 3:05 pm,
DeleteJudaism is the monotheistic religion of the Jews, having its ethical, ceremonial, and legal foundation in the precepts of the Old Testament and in the teachings and commentaries of the rabbis as found chiefly in the Talmud. Jesus fulfilled the law and the prophets. He did not fulfill a religion.
God is not religious. This is why we say, "I believe in God." We never say, "I believe in a Catholic God." In the Holy Bible, God is referred to as the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, but nowhere in the Bible does it ever say "Jewish God". Christ may have born into the world as a Jew, but the Bible was specific enough to say that He came down incarnated as "man" and even traced his genealogy to Adam and not just to Abraham.